TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Discussion on setting up QNAP NAS products.
ChesterCopperpot
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TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by ChesterCopperpot »

Hi all,
This is regarding how best to neutralize or dampen the vibration/noise/thumping from a running NAS.

I bought a TS-453BE less than 2 weeks ago.
I added 4 4TB HGST drives.

The hard drives are always churning away at something, which would be totally fine with me, except that they are constantly vibrating/thumping. The NAS is on a shelf (set into studs) one level below the living room. The thumping travels through the walls/floor and we can clearly hear it throughout the first floor. It's so bad that the dog randomly thinks we are being attacked, and barks incessantly at the NAS through the floor...

What I've tried so far:
  • I ran a full disk scan against the (brand new) hard drives and show no errors. And this is not a "clicking" sound which would indicate a problem.
  • I added acoustic-absorbing pads under the unit.
  • I added felt tape along the inside of each drive bay.
  • I screwed the hard drives tightly into their mounts.
Do I likely have a defective unit here? Any other ideas to try?
I saw one post that says thick silicone rubber bands around each drive helped... and another post saying to use rubber grommets on each hard drive screw. But I am not convinced those solutions would help as the things I've already tried did not. And I don't want to keep buying things to (potentially) counteract a design flaw or defective unit.

Looking for general consensus or what worked for you to solve this thumping noise problem.

Thank you!
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dolbyman
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by dolbyman »

I have never heard of a NAS/DISKs vibrating that much that walls shake and dogs bark

I operate 9x WD RED (non pro) drives (5x4TB 951X and 4x3TB in a 419p+) in a ventilated cabinet at home and with closed doors they are not audible, no thumping no humming.

I have a test NAS in a 19 inch rack with 6x Seagate Ironwolf Pro (853BU) and while I can hear them when I stand up close.. they do not shake anything.

Have you tried swapping the drives with slow RPM ones (like WD non Pro) ?
ChesterCopperpot
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by ChesterCopperpot »

Thanks very much for the quick reply.

To clarify: the walls themselves aren't quite shaking, but they are transmitting the thumping sound.

I do not have access to slower RPM drives to try, unfortunately. I think I have another week or two to return these HGST drives if they are faulty, if that's what you're suggesting? I could likely attempt to pull one at a time to isolate if it's just 1 problematic drive vs. all.
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dolbyman
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by dolbyman »

pulling a drive at a time could be done (RAID5+ and good external backups), you would need to wait for a while after for the resync to finish
ChesterCopperpot
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by ChesterCopperpot »

Thanks, I'm using RAID10 for these. I don't look forward to the process. I'd imagine it will take at least 4-5 days total time to pull, check noise levels, then put the drive back in to let it resync. I have NEVER used a RAID or NAS before so I'm assuming it'll go through a full resync process even if the drive was only out of the bay for a few minutes, since a few bytes likely changed.

So is the assumption here that the drives are the problem, vs. the NAS itself? Do you think it's worth adding the silicone rubber bands or drive screw grommets, or a different/better solution?
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dolbyman
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by dolbyman »

when those xxxBe units came out there were complaints about them being louder than their old metal counterparts

can't find the old thread right now but a lot was tried to tone it down. It basically is vibration of the disks, not so much fan noise.
ChesterCopperpot
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by ChesterCopperpot »

Thank you. I can't locate that one.
I saw this complaint and solution, not about my same model:
viewtopic.php?f=50&t=137894&p=651567&hi ... ds#p651567

I'm about to start popping out drives... but I am thinking it's the design of the NAS so I need to find a way to cushion everything better. Maybe even jam something between bays in case that's what's vibrating. Ugh!

If you or anyone have other solutions, please feel free to add. Thanks!
csmithwestmill
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by csmithwestmill »

I replaced WD Red non pros with Seagate Ironwolf Pros and it made a huge difference in regards the noise generated by the hard drives.
It was described as a helicopter hovering nearby when downstaires under the unit. I've resorted to placing my NAS on a cardboard box and ensuring its not touching any of the cabinet.
I can tell you for home as soon as I need to replace the drives I am not going to use a 7200rpm variant of NAS drive again.
ChesterCopperpot
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by ChesterCopperpot »

Dang. Thank you for that information. I hope to not have to replace these drives, it'd be a project. And I was so happy with the reliability reports of HGST from Backblaze etc.

I pulled one drive last night but still heard the noise (no change at all) , so it wasn't related to the first bay. Now in a 12 hour rebuild before I can try the next :(
ChesterCopperpot
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by ChesterCopperpot »

I want to follow-up in case anyone else searches this thread for a solution.

I *think* I've solved the thumping issue.

I individually detached (via Storage/Disks menu), then physically removed each drive bay during write operations (to increase the likelihood of thumping, which was generally pretty constant anyway).

When I removed the 2nd bay, the thumping subsided. I still tried each bay though to verify, but it was indeed the 2nd bay. The hard drive was securely situated in there and I didn't need to tighten the screws further. When I replaced the bay with no modifications, the thumping came back.

I restored the 2nd bay and jammed an acoustic anti-vibration pad under there. I am now proudly typing to you all in silence! So in total I have the NAS device on 4 anti-vibration pads plus the extra under the second bay, and I have those situated on a rubber flooring mat on the shelf where the unit lives. Lots of vibration absorption!

The felt tape I added along the inside of each drive bay might have helped as well, so I am leaving it.

I ordered rubber grommets for the hard drive screws, and also silicone rubber bands. Assuming the noise does not return, I will be sending those back when they arrive. So far so good, as the wife and dog are also happy!

As a side note: the RAID rebuild took 12 hours each for the first 2 disks I tried. I then learned to enable Bitmap. DO THAT. The rebuild then took a matter of minutes for the final 2 disks!

Thank you all for the attempts to help! I think this NAS could have been a bit better built to avoid vibrations like this, but I am otherwise happy with it.
pseudo
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by pseudo »

Hi ChesterCopperpot,
since last weekend I have a TS-453Be with four WD Red (WD80EFAX) in use. When I read this thread, I can confirm, that I have exactly the same problem. I would be glad if you could provide some photos of your modifications.
Thank you very much!
ChesterCopperpot
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by ChesterCopperpot »

Hi Pseudo,
Sadly my last bit of modification helped for less than a day. I think the acoustic pad that I jammed in had squashed down to a point where it was no longer absorbing anything.

I swapped out the HGST drives for 4 4TB WD RD wd40efrx drives. So I went from 7200 to 5400RPM and have no audible issue. I am sorry to learn that you are having audible issues with the WD Reds since most people rated those "whisper quiet" and my initial impression is good!

I took off the silicone bands, they seemed to do nothing. I left felt lining inside the drive bays and have the anti-vibration pads under each leg of the NAS unit.

Here are the products I went through:
I did NOT use these rubber grommets. Turns out these are the same things in the drive bays from QNAP. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00ZH ... UTF8&psc=1

I tried but took off these silicone bands. They were recommended by some blogs, but I don't think they helped the noise/vibration at all: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B018W ... UTF8&psc=1

This is the felt tape that I lined the inside of each drive bay with (I left spaces for any holes): https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0145 ... UTF8&psc=1

These are the anti-vibration pads I have under the unit. I think they help a bit. The unit already has anti-vibration "feet" but this seems to eliminate anything remaining: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07CN ... UTF8&psc=1
ChesterCopperpot
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by ChesterCopperpot »

PS: I should add that I did tightly screw in each drive to the drive bay. That step is listed as "optional" for 3.5" drives but I also think that helps eliminate potential vibration.
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deoau
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by deoau »

If I had a penny for every time I felt regret for "upgrading" my old 453 pro, to the new 453BE, I'd be quite rich!

The pretty plastic build in the new 453's is really quite horrible, and vibration noise is a major PITA. I actually found the higher RPM HGST drives seem to induce less vibration than WD Reds, but it still gets a buzzing.

The best "fix" I found was to put a little piece of foam under just one corner of the unit, front left or front right, making it sit unevenly. This little bit if twisting effect on the chassis seems to keep it quiet, for a week or two till the foam compressed, then I'd put in a new piece. Oh, and leave the pretty front perspex cover off, one less thing to vibrate.
NAS Primary TVS-h674 QTS Hero 32GB M2 Raid1 Sysvol (1TB Kingston KC3000 + 1TB Samsung 980 pro)
w. 7TB Vol1 + 28TB Raid5 (1 x Samsung SSD 870 QVO 8TB | 4 x 8TB HGST Deskstar NAS HDN728080ALE604 | 1 x 8TB Seagate Ironwolf ST8000VN004)
NAS Backup TS-453D QTS 16GB M.2 (2 x 500GB Crucial P2) w. 30TB JBOD (4 x 8TB WD Red WD80EFZX)
nog1968
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Re: TS-453BE Vibration and Thumping

Post by nog1968 »

fully solved vibration problem in a ts453 pro with ironwolf 7200rpm by adding 2 standards chair or table FELT pads on each HD tray in the middle of the tray external side . this tips is only for hd vibration problem

pour mes amis Francais j 'ai résolu mon problème très casse pied de vibration de disque dur 7200 rpm dans mon nas Qnap ts 453 pro en collant au milieu de tout les supports disque coté extérieur deux pauvres pads en feutrine de genre 2 mm d épaisseur que l on colle habituellement sous les pieds des tables . depuis c'est d un silence parfait hormis le bruit des DD qui grattent . en espérant que ce soit utile a certains
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