TS-251 Backup from Disk1 to Disk2

[nas904]

I've done quite a bit of search so I apologize if this has already been addressed. If so, a link would be helpful.

I'm attempting to replicate disk 1 to disk 2. As we all know, RAID is not a backup[1][2][3][etc]. It only exists to increase availability or performance. It does not protect from accidental deletion, malware (e.g., cryptolocker, etc) or simple filesystem corruption. For me personally, accidentally deleting a file is far more likely than a disk failing

I've got two HDD and I want to be able to backup from disk 1 to disk 2 whenever I want (usually around once a month).

The only way I've found to do this is by creating an rsync job. Is this the best way to do it or is there some other way to copy between internal disks? Ideally it would be a complete copy of disk1 to disk2 so if disk1 fails I can simply move disk2 to slot one and boot from that.


1 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4m3qnbzif3U
2 - https://serverfault.com/questions/2888/ ... t-a-backup
3 - https://www.2brightsparks.com/resources ... ution.html

[nas904]

*** If anyone has an idea for syncing the ENTIRE disk and not just folders, please let me know! ***

I think I may have found the best option for doing this. This wouldn't allow me to boot to Disk2 should Disk1 fail, but at least it gives me a real backup. I installed "Hybrid Backup Sync" which appears to replace Backup Station. This may be available in Backup Station as well, but I didn't see it. Hybrid Backup Sync allows you to create a "Sync Job".

To sync from one internal disk to another:
1. Open Hybrid Backup Sync
2. Click Sync (there are 3 options: Backup, Restore, Sync - choose Sync, not backup)
3. Choose "One-way Sync" option at the top
4. Click "Sync with local NAS"
5. Select Source and Destination folders (use File Station to create a backup folder on Disk2 if you haven't already).
6. Click "Add"
7. Click "Apply" at the bottom right.

I left the setting at "Real Time" for the sync because "One Time" required you to set a date/time. So I just used "Real Time" sync and stopped the job once it was complete. That way the next time I want to sync the disks I can:
1. Open Hybrid Backup Sync
2. Click "All Jobs"
3. Start the existing, but stopped, Real Time Sync Job.

[dolbyman]

don't reinvent the wheel

raid 1 for your nas ...backups on an external drive/nas/cloud

check the forum ...it is discussed 2 to 3 times per week

[nas904]

Are you going to buy the third disk for me? This is my home NAS, I need neither the performance nor the extra availability of RAID. I'm not "reinventing" anything. I'm trying to make a backup of a disk. This is literally the most basic, fundamental thing you can do to prevent data loss. Why do I need to do it to an external disk when it has two bays?

This is really simple. I have data on a disk and I want to back it up to another disk. I don't want or need RAID. What exactly am I reinventing?

[OneCD]

Copying your data from internal drive 1 to internal drive 2 in the same device is NOT a backup. Backups are external to your NAS.

What exactly am I reinventing?

As @dolbyman suggested, RAID 1 is the best option for what you've asked to do. You would be reinventing the wheel by trying to replicate this by manually duplicating drive 1 to drive 2. That's what RAID 1 does.

Create a RAID 1 with your 2 internal drives - and yes - purchase a 3rd drive to perform external backups. If you don't value your data enough to purchase a 3rd drive, then it can't be that important to you.

Or, if you don't want to create an array, remove your second drive and use it externally as a backup target. Just don't keep it inside your NAS.

Why do I need to do it to an external disk when it has two bays?

Your NAS is not a simple drive enclosure. If that's what you wanted, then that's what you should have bought.

[nas904]

Copying your data from internal drive 1 to internal drive 2 in the same device is NOT a backup.

Wrong.

back·up
ˈbakˌəp/Submit
noun
1.
help or support.
"no police backup could be expected"
synonyms: help, support, assistance, aid; More
2.
COMPUTING
the procedure for making extra copies of data in case the original is lost or damaged.

As @dolbyman suggested, RAID 1 is the best option for what you've asked to do. You would be reinventing the wheel by trying to replicate this by manually duplicating drive 1 to drive 2. That's what RAID 1 does.

Wrong again. Say it with me: RAID IS NOT A BACKUP. RAID replicates EVERYTHING, including filesystem corruption, accidental file deletions, etc.

Create a RAID 1 with your 2 internal drives - and yes - purchase a 3rd drive to perform external backups. If you don't value your data enough to purchase a 3rd drive, then it can't be that important to you.

Wrong again. It's important enough to store two copies, not three. That's why I make backups.

Or, if you don't want to create an array, remove your second drive and use it externally as a backup target. Just don't keep it inside your NAS.

What is the difference between attaching it to a USB enclosure attached to my NAS versus the internal drive bay? If it will make you feel better, I'll remove the hot swappable caddy and disk from the enclosure every time I make a backup. What you're suggesting doesn't make any sense.

Your NAS is not a simple drive enclosure. If that's what you wanted, then that's what you should have bought.

I bought it to function as a NAS, not a simple drive enclosure. It's a file server. If I just wanted an external enclosure attached to a single machine I would have bought one. The point is to provide access to multiple clients on a network. You seem to think a NAS requires RAID. You are wrong.

[dolbyman]

ugh...

fine copy disk 1 to disk 2

if your nas hardware dies..good luck accessing your data..because internal drives cannot be read outside of a qnap nas (without extensive knowlage of linux and lvm structure)

it has been discussed many many times..if you dont want to listen to advice..why ask?

[OneCD]

Geez, the trolls are up early this morning...

Say it with me: RAID IS NOT A BACKUP. RAID replicates EVERYTHING, including filesystem corruption, accidental file deletions, etc.

Thanks new guy - I know what RAID 1 does. Do you?

Wrong again. It's important enough to store two copies, not three. That's why I make backups.

It was only a suggestion. Hey, perceive it how you will...

What is the difference between attaching it to a USB enclosure attached to my NAS versus the internal drive bay? If it will make you feel better, I'll remove the hot swappable caddy and disk from the enclosure every time I make a backup. What you're suggesting doesn't make any sense.

Can say that I feel too inclined to enlighten you right now. But I'm sure your know-it-all and can't-be-told attitude will see you through.

You seem to think a NAS requires RAID. You are wrong.

Wrong. That's not what I said. Please read my responses carefully before commenting further.

[nas904]

ugh...

fine copy disk 1 to disk 2

if your nas hardware dies..good luck accessing your data..because internal drives cannot be read outside of a qnap nas (without extensive knowlage of linux and lvm structure)

I'm extremely familiar with LVM (and ext4, and ext3 and 2 and xfs and btrfs and a million other filesystems) and Linux, I've been using Linux daily for the last 20 years. I work on storage systems professionally (EMC, 3PAR, large fibre channel SANs along with NFS and various other storage tech, e.g., ceph, gluster, etc). This is what would happen if my primary drive failed: I'd buy a new one, put it in, boot my NAS, restore my NAS config backup, copy files back from Disk2 to Disk1.

it has been discussed many many times..if you dont want to listen to advice..why ask?

I just want to know if it's possible to copy data from Disk1 to Disk2. I don't want someone's opinion on whether or not to run RAID.

[OneCD]

I've got two HDD and I want to be able to backup from disk 1 to disk 2 whenever I want (usually around once a month).

The only way I've found to do this is by creating an rsync job. Is this the best way to do it or is there some other way to copy between internal disks? Ideally it would be a complete copy of disk1 to disk2 so if disk1 fails I can simply move disk2 to slot one and boot from that.

I'm extremely familiar with LVM (and ext4, and ext3 and 2 and xfs and btrfs and a million other filesystems) and Linux, I've been using Linux daily for the last 20 years. I work on storage systems professionally (EMC, 3PAR, large fibre channel SANs along with NFS and various other storage tech, e.g., ceph, gluster, etc).

You've been using Linux daily for the last 20 years and you don't know how to duplicate disks?

[nas904]

Geez, the trolls are up early this morning...

Say it with me: RAID IS NOT A BACKUP. RAID replicates EVERYTHING, including filesystem corruption, accidental file deletions, etc.

Thanks new guy - I know what RAID 1 does. Do you?

Obviously you don't because you just told me it was the same thing as making a backup to a second disk.

Wrong again. It's important enough to store two copies, not three. That's why I make backups.

It was only a suggestion. Hey, perceive it how you will...

Not interested in your suggestions. I asked a simple question, I don't care about your opinion on RAID or whether or not it's the correct choice for my use case.

What is the difference between attaching it to a USB enclosure attached to my NAS versus the internal drive bay? If it will make you feel better, I'll remove the hot swappable caddy and disk from the enclosure every time I make a backup. What you're suggesting doesn't make any sense.

Can say that I feel too inclined to enlighten you right now. But I'm sure your know-it-all and can't-be-told attitude will see you through.

Sorry that being wrong offends you so much.

[nas904]

I've got two HDD and I want to be able to backup from disk 1 to disk 2 whenever I want (usually around once a month).

The only way I've found to do this is by creating an rsync job. Is this the best way to do it or is there some other way to copy between internal disks? Ideally it would be a complete copy of disk1 to disk2 so if disk1 fails I can simply move disk2 to slot one and boot from that.

I'm extremely familiar with LVM (and ext4, and ext3 and 2 and xfs and btrfs and a million other filesystems) and Linux, I've been using Linux daily for the last 20 years. I work on storage systems professionally (EMC, 3PAR, large fibre channel SANs along with NFS and various other storage tech, e.g., ceph, gluster, etc).

You've been using Linux daily for the last 20 years and you don't know how to duplicate disks?

I know about a thousand ways to, I'm trying to find the "QNAP" way to, because I've only been using it for about 2 days. Personally I'd just rsync it.

But I guess I'll just use RAID1 because "it's the same as making a backup" according to you.

I came to this forum for advice on using the QNAP GUI. You are not qualified to give me advice on storage architecture or backup strategy. Please stick to what you know.

[OneCD]

The only way I've found to do this is by creating an rsync job. Is this the best way to do it or is there some other way to copy between internal disks? Ideally it would be a complete copy of disk1 to disk2 so if disk1 fails I can simply move disk2 to slot one and boot from that.

I know about a thousand ways to, I'm trying to find the "QNAP" way to, because I've only been using it for about 2 days. Personally I'd just rsync it.

So, do you know a thousand ways or do you only know one way? Sheez, make up your mind.

Rsync - wow - you really need help, don't you?

But I guess I'll just use RAID1 because "it's the same as making a backup" according to you.

A claim I have not made once.

Hmm, until you learn how to read, maybe the GUI is the best thing for you. Nice simple pictures - not much reading required there...

I came to this forum for advice on using the QNAP GUI.

Then you should have stated that in your OP. Please learn how to communicate effectively.

[dolbyman]

of course ..somone with decades of IT knowlage is to skilled to read the manual (all gui options explained in there) and too rich to buy an additional disk for backups

can a mod please close this thread?...it gets old

[OneCD]

I'd lock it @dolbyman, but seems I no longer have that option. Anyone else?