TVS-873 and Seagate Ironwolf 10TB

[md1972]

Hello I have a TVS-873 and I want to buy later a (few) Ironwolf 10TB harddisk(s).
I´m a little bit unsure if I should buy the hdd(s) because I´ve heard that there are problems with constant clicking noises when idle?
That should be an error which increases the SMART Load Cycle Count?!
This problem should affect QNAP and Synolgy NAS equally.

See here in the synology forum: https://forum.synology.com/enu/viewtopi ... 1&start=45
I´m honest, I don´t want to change the disable EPC (Extended Power Conditions) in the firmware.
I think the QNAP NAS should control the hdd completly.

Is it safe now to buy the 10TB Ironwolf? Which firmware should be installed at the hdd? SC61?
My TVS-873 has firmware version 4.3.3.0154.
Michael.

[dolbyman]

I know of load cycle issues with green and early red Seagate drives ...but not of Ironwolf..any link ?

[kherr4377]

personally Seagate left a sour taste in my mouth the way they pushed the DM dives as NAS compatible, i don't trust them. long term use has shown that WD and especially HGST have better track records than Seagate. the Ironwolf is relatively new and no track record. good specs, but if they don't last, what good are they??? my WD REDS (8 X 3TB) are over 4 years old and no faults yet.

[Trexx]

I also can't speak to the reliability/noise of the Seagate IronWolf as they are still too new and I have never used them personally. What kind of storage needs do you have pushing you toward 10TB drives?

Remember the larger the HDD, the longer the rebuild time (and risk) WHEN it fails. So regardless of brand, make sure you are using RAID-6, and have a good UPS when you are getting that many drives/size. I have been using HGST's NAS drives for many years and have been very happy with them. Plus you get the 7200rpm performance in all models vs. only in the larger IronWolf's.

[md1972]

Here are some links:
viewtopic.php?t=127866
another one in my foreign language (german) with the Load-Cycle-Count problem of the IronWolf hdds described:
https://www.hardwareluxx.de/index.php/a ... ml?start=5

My current system is 12xhdds (synology ds2413+) with 7x4tb+5x2tb=38tb connected to pc/nvidia shield.
I want to be future proof and want to double it to 8x10tb=80tb
Everything only legal video stuff for my amusement. I´m using no raid, single disks only. I want to backup manual everything with freefilesync.

[dolbyman]

if you want no backups .. fair enough but when the first drive(system) dies, you have to start from scratch

maybe think about RAID1 at least for the system


So I just read the hardwareluxx.de article and apparently there is no "easy fix" like for the WD green and early red drives.

Question is if QNAP even implements those EPC (Extended Power Conditions) functions. Only support would know for sure

[md1972]

The TVS-873 will be the backup from the Synology NAS. (later)
I know that the HGST are very reliable, but have a look:
To backup everything I need:
5x8TB HGST Deskstar ~5x300.-
4x10TB Ironwolf ~4x375.-
The price for the 4xIronwolf is a little bit lower than for the 5xHGST and I have 2 advantages:
1)One less hdd rotating means less noise
2)More space for additional movies (8x8=64TB=100% / 8x10TB=80TB=125%)

The only thing is that I dont know how reliable the Ironwolf are.

[dolbyman]

well lots of storage costs lots of money

with 80TB of storage I would be very hard pressed to find a suitable backup location other than a cheaper NAS

so 8x10TB I would put in RAID6 (lots of big drives with lots of rebuild time and error prone) then get a second unit (maybe a 831X with 10GBE) for backups

[kherr4377]

... the 873 IS the backup

[dolbyman]

ohh I see, kinda wasteful in terms of energy to get a x73 then, if it only serves as backup

but also, why single drives then for a backup, wouldn't you want the backup space to be consolidated ?

[kherr4377]

... and having an 80TB JBOD doesn't sound too wise either ...... he really hasn't said anything about actual setup, said "80TB with 8 X 10TB drives" guess from there ..

[md1972]

OK, here is my plan:
First I backup the entire Synology to the TVS manual via file copy one hdd to another hdd.
Then I use the TVS-873 as the main NAS an the Synology as the backup NAS.
I need the TVS and a powerful CPU (and x64 platform) because I use Emby Server in my flat. (nothing more, have a huge database)

Then (~3..4 years from now on) I´m buying another new NAS (x64) as THE mainserver and the other (TVS) will be the backup NAS. Later the Synology will go completly in retirement. (third "low" storage for ???)

I only use single hdd, no JBOD, no RAID, nothing. I make everything manual (filecopying via freefilesync). I´ve tried Qsync 1/2 years ago with my TS809pro. It was a desaster. Nothing automatic anymore for me.

The main goal is silence!!! The 12 hdds are loud as hell. I need silence in my room.
I think 4x10TB is much better than 12xhdds(4+2). I want very few noise and I need a huge space.

[Trexx]

Good Plan, but I would echo others and implement RAID-6 so that if the wrong drive fails, you don't loose your entire NAS configuration. It also allow you to easily upgrade to even larger drives later without having to manually do the file copies again.

As for migrating the data, just use RTRR to do the data copy between the 2 NAS would be the simplest option.

As for data syncing from PC to NAS, you can use all sorts of options (QSync, Syncthing, etc.)

[seagate_surfer]

I´m a little bit unsure if I should buy the hdd(s) because I´ve heard that there are problems with constant clicking noises when idle?
Michael.

Hi, we would like to follow up on the clicking noises you mentioned:

QNAP systems by default check SMART every 5 minutes from each drive. When idle, this causes the drive to go active to update data and immediately go back to idle which is where the drive is incurring load/unload cycle.

There are are multiple ways to remedy this issue:
(1) Users can obtain Seatools from Seagate tech support which can disable APM/EPC.
(2) Another way to minimize the clicking sound is to change the SMART update timer to a longer interval within the storage manager setting within QNAP QTS. Seagate recommends the interval at 30 minutes or longer.
(3) For a better overall system performance, disabling APM/EPC and increasing the SMART check interval are recommended.