How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Questions about SNMP, Power, System, Logs, disk, & RAID.
ili
Starting out
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:48 am

How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by ili »

Hi
In light of the recent ransomware reports and this QNAP article:
https://www.qnap.com/solution/ransomware/en/

I wanted to create a snapshot to protect my data, but I don't see how to do it on my TS-412 firmware 4.3.3
How do I create a snapshot?
Thank you
User avatar
OneCD
Guru
Posts: 12039
Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2016 10:48 am
Location: "... there, behind that sofa!"

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by OneCD »

Hi and welcome to the forum. :)

Sorry - I don't think your TS-412 supports snapshots:
QNAP wrote:1. Snapshots and related features are currently only available for the following NAS series: TS-X51*, TS-X53, TVS-X63, TVS-X70, TVS-X71, TVS-X73, TVS-X79, TVS-X80, TVS-X82, TES-X85, TDS-X89.
2. A minimum of 4 GB RAM is required to use snapshots.
Some more info: https://www.qnap.com/en/how-to/tutorial ... -turbo-nas

ImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImage
ili
Starting out
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:48 am

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by ili »

OneCD wrote:Hi and welcome to the forum. :)

Sorry - I don't think your TS-412 supports snapshots:
QNAP wrote:1. Snapshots and related features are currently only available for the following NAS series: TS-X51*, TS-X53, TVS-X63, TVS-X70, TVS-X71, TVS-X73, TVS-X79, TVS-X80, TVS-X82, TES-X85, TDS-X89.
2. A minimum of 4 GB RAM is required to use snapshots.
Some more info: https://www.qnap.com/en/how-to/tutorial ... -turbo-nas
I'm so disappointed from this product software nerfed and deliberately restricted in every possible way.
If anyone thinking of buying a QNAP product from the "Home product lineup" just don't, as in QNAP prospective you are a B class customer.
Either go for something from the "SMB product lineup" or buy a Synology product
User avatar
dolbyman
Guru
Posts: 35024
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2011 2:11 am
Location: Vancouver BC , Canada

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by dolbyman »

the 412 is almost a decade old ....it reached eol ..so no more new features
User avatar
Trexx
Ask me anything
Posts: 5393
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 7:50 am
Location: Minnesota

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by Trexx »

Agreed... QNAP puts features into NAS based on CPU & Memory of NAS model being able to support them. Your TS-412 can't as it neither has the CPU horsepower or memory too.

Just like a 10 year old computer won't run Windows 10.
Paul

Model: TS-877-1600 FW: 4.5.3.x
QTS (SSD): [RAID-1] 2 x 1TB WD Blue m.2's
Data (HDD): [RAID-5] 6 x 3TB HGST DeskStar
VMs (SSD): [RAID-1] 2 x1TB SK Hynix Gold
Ext. (HDD): TR-004 [Raid-5] 4 x 4TB HGST Ultastor
RAM: Kingston HyperX Fury 64GB DDR4-2666
UPS: CP AVR1350

Model:TVS-673 32GB & TS-228a Offline[/color]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2018 Plex NAS Compatibility Guide | QNAP Plex FAQ | Moogle's QNAP Faq
ili
Starting out
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:48 am

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by ili »

dolbyman wrote:the 412 is almost a decade old ....it reached eol ..so no more new features
Trexx wrote:Agreed... QNAP puts features into NAS based on CPU & Memory of NAS model being able to support them. Your TS-412 can't as it neither has the CPU horsepower or memory too.

Just like a 10 year old computer won't run Windows 10.
Tell me this guys, If I get a bran new TS-431P
Will I have snapshots support?
Will I have SMB 3.X support?

Regarding CPU & Memory limitation, If that was true how come this low spec device can do snapshots?
https://www.synology.com/en-global/products/DS416j#spec
User avatar
dolbyman
Guru
Posts: 35024
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2011 2:11 am
Location: Vancouver BC , Canada

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by dolbyman »

yes...the x31P does have cat2 feature set
P3R
Guru
Posts: 13190
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 1:39 am
Location: Stockholm, Sweden (UTC+01:00)

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by P3R »

ili wrote:Tell me this guys, If I get a bran new TS-431P
Will I have snapshots support?
I think you need an Intel-based platform for that, like TS-451+ or TS-451A. Check out the product comparison.
Will I have SMB 3.X support?
I think so but I'm not sure.
Regarding CPU & Memory limitation, If that was true how come this low spec device can do snapshots?
https://www.synology.com/en-global/products/DS416j#spec
1. That NAS have better performance than a TS-410
2. As far as I can tell that NAS was introduced 2016, TS-412 was introduced 2009. That's not a fair comparison!
3. Can that NAS really do snapshots? According to the the Syno site you need to get up to Intel-based models to have snapshot support, exactly as with Qnap.
RAID have never ever been a replacement for backups. Without backups on a different system (preferably placed at another site), you will eventually lose data!

A non-RAID configuration (including RAID 0, which isn't really RAID) with a backup on a separate media protects your data far better than any RAID-volume without backup.

All data storage consists of both the primary storage and the backups. It's your money and your data, spend the storage budget wisely or pay with your data!
ili
Starting out
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:48 am

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by ili »

P3R wrote:
ili wrote:Tell me this guys, If I get a bran new TS-431P
Will I have snapshots support?
I think you need an Intel-based platform for that, like TS-451+ or TS-451A. Check out the product comparison.
Will I have SMB 3.X support?
I think so but I'm not sure.
Regarding CPU & Memory limitation, If that was true how come this low spec device can do snapshots?
https://www.synology.com/en-global/products/DS416j#spec
1. That NAS have better performance than a TS-410
2. As far as I can tell that NAS was introduced 2016, TS-412 was introduced 2009. That's not a fair comparison!
3. Can that NAS really do snapshots? According to the the Syno site you need to get up to Intel-based models to have snapshot support, exactly as with Qnap.
Thank you
looks like you are correct, neither the QNAP or the Synology ARM solutions support snapshots.
It's pretty useless in my opinion to have a NAS system without a way to protect yourself from encryption ransomware that are very popular this days, It dose not protect your data any more then if it was an extra disk in your PC...
User avatar
dolbyman
Guru
Posts: 35024
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2011 2:11 am
Location: Vancouver BC , Canada

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by dolbyman »

have external backups..and dont use the admin user for smb access (external drives are by default on accessible by admin) ..and that works only every qnap nas system

tadaaa...ransomware protection
ili
Starting out
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:48 am

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by ili »

dolbyman wrote:have external backups..and dont use the admin user for smb access (external drives are by default on accessible by admin) ..and that works only every qnap nas system

tadaaa...ransomware protection
To backup to an external drive I don't need a NAS at all
P3R
Guru
Posts: 13190
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 1:39 am
Location: Stockholm, Sweden (UTC+01:00)

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by P3R »

ili wrote:It's pretty useless in my opinion to have a NAS system without a way to protect yourself from encryption ransomware that are very popular this days, It dose not protect your data any more then if it was an extra disk in your PC...
Unfortunately you've misunderstood many things here. Apart from the things I've already commented on, local snapshots aren't really an effective protection against ransomware. :(

As dolbyman explains, the protection against ransomware is to make backups externally of the system which the backup is protecting. More specifically you also need to have those backups versioned. When you have that, you can easily go back in time with your data to before the system was hit by the ransomware.

As for the current Wannacry outbreak, the protection is much simpler - always have all your Windows systems updated with the latest security patches!

And even if you've failed with the above, don't pay the ransom. If you do, the criminals will only get stronger and better and hit you (and many others) worse the next time... :roll:
RAID have never ever been a replacement for backups. Without backups on a different system (preferably placed at another site), you will eventually lose data!

A non-RAID configuration (including RAID 0, which isn't really RAID) with a backup on a separate media protects your data far better than any RAID-volume without backup.

All data storage consists of both the primary storage and the backups. It's your money and your data, spend the storage budget wisely or pay with your data!
ili
Starting out
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:48 am

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by ili »

P3R wrote:
ili wrote:It's pretty useless in my opinion to have a NAS system without a way to protect yourself from encryption ransomware that are very popular this days, It dose not protect your data any more then if it was an extra disk in your PC...
Unfortunately you've misunderstood many things here. Apart from the things I've already commented on, local snapshots aren't really an effective protection against ransomware. :(

As dolbyman explains, the protection against ransomware is to make backups externally of the system which the backup is protecting. More specifically you also need to have those backups versioned. When you have that, you can easily go back in time with your data to before the system was hit by the ransomware.

As for the current Wannacry outbreak, the protection is much simpler - always have all your Windows systems updated with the latest security patches!

And even if you've failed with the above, don't pay the ransom. If you do, the criminals will only get stronger and better and hit you (and many others) worse the next time... :roll:
I have versioned backups but not externally, I understand that external backups are a "good solution" but not for many people in the real world
First obviously you need to buy one :lol: so there is the extra cost
Second you need to remember to connect it & disconnect it afterwords
And even then to be compliantly safe you need to buy 2 external drives in case you will get attacked while backing up

So snapshots are way more covenant solution and safer in many cases as you will probably forget to backup to your external drive from time to time

P.S My Windows is patched up but you don't know what 0Day vulnerability will pop up next time
Last edited by ili on Sun May 14, 2017 8:17 am, edited 2 times in total.
P3R
Guru
Posts: 13190
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 1:39 am
Location: Stockholm, Sweden (UTC+01:00)

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by P3R »

ili wrote:To backup to an external drive I don't need a NAS at all
It depends on the amount of data but generally no. But then again, I haven't seen anyone claiming the main reason for getting a NAS is to protect you from ransomware... :roll:
  • A NAS can be an excellent destination for versioned backups of all your clients...if you're smart enough to do backups on all of them.
  • A NAS is an excellent way to share data between multiple clients.
  • A NAS offer many applications and services, including all the media services that are very useful to many home users.
  • A NAS offer a very affordable solution to keep data always instantly available and also doing so with a fault tolerant disk configuration
RAID have never ever been a replacement for backups. Without backups on a different system (preferably placed at another site), you will eventually lose data!

A non-RAID configuration (including RAID 0, which isn't really RAID) with a backup on a separate media protects your data far better than any RAID-volume without backup.

All data storage consists of both the primary storage and the backups. It's your money and your data, spend the storage budget wisely or pay with your data!
P3R
Guru
Posts: 13190
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 1:39 am
Location: Stockholm, Sweden (UTC+01:00)

Re: How to create snapshot to protect against ransomware?

Post by P3R »

ili wrote:I have versioned backups but not externally, I understand that external backups are a "good solution" but not for many people in the real world
Not having external backups will unfortunately some day cause you data loss. :cry:

Actually all administrators with experience of "the real world" will tell you that external backups is what will protect your data in the end. We happen to know that because we've already lost data when we didn't manage our backups properly. That's part of how we became experienced.
First obviously you need to buy one :lol: so there is the extra cost
Yes, insurances are never without cost. Of course you have to compare the cost for the backup with the value of the data. If the data is of very low value, then a backup may not be necessary.

There's cost for snapshots as well, and as snapshots protect from less threats they're really less cost effective than exterrnal backups. Snapshots are a convenient addition to backups. To use them instead of backups is dangerous!

Since you don't seem to believe the experienced administrators here, lets get a second opinion from a pretty well known company in the industry:
While storage snapshots are widely used to quickly create point-in-time virtual copies of data, they are also often marketed as valid “backup solutions”. This is an incorrect and dangerous assumption because snapshots, unless copied to secondary media (e.g. another storage array or tape), do not protect against media failures. While there are benefits of using snapshots for development or testing purposes on non-production systems, they should not be considered as valid data protection or backups...
RAID have never ever been a replacement for backups. Without backups on a different system (preferably placed at another site), you will eventually lose data!

A non-RAID configuration (including RAID 0, which isn't really RAID) with a backup on a separate media protects your data far better than any RAID-volume without backup.

All data storage consists of both the primary storage and the backups. It's your money and your data, spend the storage budget wisely or pay with your data!
Post Reply

Return to “System & Disk Volume Management”