[HOW TO] Home assistant install on QNAP NAS

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

*update

updated how to setup and install home assistant. The one i opted for is docker setup using portainer. everything explained at the link
viewtopic.php?f=45&t=166564&p=835025#p835020





*archived old post

https://www.home-assistant.io/installation/alternative

scroll down to QNAP NAS and the instructions are there. But basically they tell u to use container station to install HA.


Another method is to use virtual station, but isn't container station more power efficient for something like this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-oww-GaMbc


And the last method is to use the QPKG which u can get here
https://qnapclub.eu/en/qpkg/1222

but the problem with the QPKG method is, they ask u to install a apache pre-requisite. So i looked for how to do this, and it seems this pre-requisite qpkg is not free
viewtopic.php?f=320&t=163941


so TLDR the recommendation for HA, is either container station or virtual station.


This is a review for home assistant
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FaSG1ux5miA




Other alternatives to home assistant is IFTTT, which i DO NOT recommend. watch this as to why
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZmoKQLK7DY




my first foray into iot is this yeelight w3
https://youtu.be/gaiNiEQ8Qsw?t=305


doesn't require a hub (although it will work with home assistant according to paul), and works with android installed it and no issues so far. Now i'm just testing how to get this to work with home assistant

This particular device uses wifi. So i setup a guest wifi for it, to keep it separate from my private lan, just in case. I believe paul mentioned there being offline solutions, so this will take some research if u want to tighten control for these iot devices, because there is a risk of vulnerability if not properly managed.

https://www.techtarget.com/iotagenda/ti ... prioritize

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

Anyway i see the benefits for iot, in particular led light automatic scheduling which to me is useful. maybe there is more, but this is as deep i've gotten too so far.

but the iot industry is bleak in their approach to adoption x_x; Paul will explain....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7OXzVzHon4c

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

ok so i managed to install the home assistant using the container station method. it's easy following instructions.

few things i noticed

1. iot is on another subnet (which was intentional to keep iot away from private lan devices). So if you do intend to use homeassistant with iot, u will need it to be on the same subnet afaik.

2. container station mentions something important to start transitioning to LXD containers. So u might want to find about that. I tried, but i couldn't get LXD containers to install so i gave up and just used the regular images that just worked.

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

on this particular yeelight w3 device, the home assistant adds a few other things that the yeelight android app doesn't. some of the color profiles r much nicer (probly created by the iot community for yeelight).

In order to get this to work on home assistant, i had to temporarily reset the device by on/off 5 times for 2 sec each time until the light start flashing before turning white. i do this so i can switch from the guest wifi to private lan so i can interface with the qnap nas that is hosting home assistant.

after doing my test, i reset and switched it back to the guest wifi. I don't feel particularly comfortable having it on private lan where my more critical devices reside.

i could probably setup the spare qnap to be on the guest subnet, but not too bothered. i tried but it didn't work for some reason. i would have to dig deeper to find out the blockage but it's not worth the headache for me. but by logic thats how u would do it i guess (having the home assistant server running on same subnet as the iot? probly a rasperry pi device to manage those things, cause i rather use a qnap nas for main storage for private lan normally)



from my brief look at home asistant, looks nice but seems there is a lot of technical stuff.... i had to dig around before i learned how to control the yeelight lightning and stuff, but to setup things like scheduling ... is a headache. by comparison using the yeelight android app, it's so fast and easy....

but if something ever happened to yeelight servers, i assume that home assistant can fill that void and make this type of iot device to continue to work ?

anyway thats my review of IOT using QNAP with home assistant

[moody_blue]

One of the reasons I come here daily are these little gems published by Moogle.

Not that I'm a HA fan, on the contrary, I've opted for OpenHab, but I'm certainly an Iot fan. Lights are probably the first thing that people uses in IoT, but the real benefit comes from the integration of sensors and cloud services. Here are some of the automations that I've done so far:

1) automatically switch on some lights at night when I'm at home
2) Manage garden irrigation / watering based on wheather forecast and soil humidity
3) Manage dehumidification
4) Manage heating
5) Manage hot water
6) Block garage door when alarm is on
7) Send whatsapp / telegram alerts when needed (flood in the basement, low battery levels, dehumidifier water container full, etc)

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

One of the reasons I come here daily are these little gems published by Moogle.

Not that I'm a HA fan, on the contrary, I've opted for OpenHab, but I'm certainly an Iot fan. Lights are probably the first thing that people uses in IoT, but the real benefit comes from the integration of sensors and cloud services. Here are some of the automations that I've done so far:

1) automatically switch on some lights at night when I'm at home
2) Manage garden irrigation / watering based on wheather forecast and soil humidity
3) Manage dehumidification
4) Manage heating
5) Manage hot water
6) Block garage door when alarm is on
7) Send whatsapp / telegram alerts when needed (flood in the basement, low battery levels, dehumidifier water container full, etc)

openhab whats that? u mean this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4_CKUGAOmA


this is my first time trying iot and also using home assistant. i mostly watch paul who seems to know alot about this, so from him i was looking at what are the good options to get into this space. basically what ur describing sounds kinda like paul's iot home tour
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tQ30L6Z2k4

so i appreciate ur feedback, i'll try look into those things on youtube in my spare time, cause they sound interesting. these types of automations for further efficiencies/power & savings is a topic i'm quite interested in :} but the reason why i've stayed away for so long... was my paranoia about iot security :/ Only once i got some vlan managed switches and devices did i think i might be able to play with this after hardening these device away from my private lan stuff.

haven't used ha long enuff or other options, but ha ui and setup looks nice and i can see it'being used to manage a bunch of different stuff. and i like the fact that it looks to be free for most part that i could tell. but i found this article that delves into the costs of running home assistant
https://leonardosmarthomemakers.com/how ... -software/

reading it, it says home assistant has an OPTIONAL cloud service for remote access, which i don't need. So seems better than IFTTT who forces u into paying subscription, becauz the free version is basicaly junk


anyway for qnap stuff, i'm not quite adding anything new lately. just some stuff i find of interest i'll post in now and then. but probly by next year i'll post an article/personal review on 2.5gbe networking experience, thats the next project i will be posting about. but there are already some people who have already posted about that stuff that is much more interesting than my content if u want to check on that topic

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CmSE6KQdbM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YetKfMcdZj4

[moody_blue]

OpenHab (OH) https://www.openhab.org/ and Home Assistant (HA) https://www.home-assistant.io/ are two of the widest used open source platforms. There are more platforms, some proprietary, others open source. Frankly, between HA and OH is a matter of personal preference. I've opted for OH mainly because at the time (2yrs ago) there were two qpkg's for qnap and the OH one was more robust (HA suffered from non-installed prereqs in qnap). Today the situation is probably different.

I have a separate vlan for my IoT devices whose firewall blocks internet access (not a big deal for guys like you that use pfsense and unify) and I do not use any voice control. Also I do not use any IoT cloud service. One of my qnap's NICs is parametrized to access the IoT vlan. I can access qnap remotely via a wireguard vpn, it works very well, so my mobile phones can access OH remotely if needed.

That said, both OH and HA work in QNAP either via containers (I hate to use containers, my qnap becomes unstable, but this option is free of charge), or paid qpkg's (OpenHab3 has a residual cost, and HA requires a paid Apache qpkg).

[moody_blue]

NAS is not a recommended platform to use an IoT system. One reason is that you are on your own, not many people will be able to help you in case of trouble. Another important reason is that, sooner or later, IoT users will install non-IP devices and this requires specialized gateways. Some gateways can connect to wifi but the most popular ones connect to usb ports and hw/driver compatibility with qnap is a nightmare. Last, but not least, IoT systems are interrupt driven. Your CPU cannot execute long running processes (such as video transcoding) otherwise the IoT system cannot react timely.

I use a NAS for IoT, yes, but I've learned to avoid such problems.

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

NAS is not a recommended platform to use an IoT system. One reason is that you are on your own, not many people will be able to help you in case of trouble. Another important reason is that, sooner or later, IoT users will install non-IP devices and this requires specialized gateways. Some gateways can connect to wifi but the most popular ones connect to usb ports and hw/driver compatibility with qnap is a nightmare. Last, but not least, IoT systems are interrupt driven. Your CPU cannot execute long running processes (such as video transcoding) otherwise the IoT system cannot react timely.

I use a NAS for IoT, yes, but I've learned to avoid such problems.

is there any firewall rules to setup for this? i use default pfsense firewall rules, and i don't port forward. is that enough?

the thing is, i did setup a vlan, strictly for iot. so i setup the yeelight to connect to the iot wifi on 2.4ghz.

The issue with this i found, then you're strictly at the mercy of the yeelight app for turning off/on and managing the led.

but in a situation where you have no internet (on some rare occassion this happened), you can't on/off control the thing using the app.

so then i thought to set it up with home assistant (HA docker running on container station hosted on qnap nas. And on android smartphone using HA app to control it like a remote control)
https://hackmd.io/@EIIupNI8Qn6uErVkCnaA ... ?type=view


issue here is, QNAP is on private lan subnet, but the yeelight iot is on the iot vlan, so they can't talk (because the homeassistant server is on private lan separate from iot vlan).


so to get it to work, had to set the yeelight to be on the private lan wifi. So now the yeelight works with it's native app AND home assistant. So when the native app doesn't work, i can use the home assistant.

To my understanding the lan control makes it able to work with home assistant without the default yeelight requirement for having internet access ? correct me if i am wrong on this part, but this is my assumpe, and main reason for using the home assistant (hosted on qnap nas) to pair to yeelight.


is there a solution to separate the iot from private lan to achieve a similar usage?



from usage testing, there is no lag on/off using home assistant android app. responsiveness doesn't seem to have any issues.

when your discussing about specialized gateways, are you talking about iot devices using hubs? the yeelight i am using does not use the specialized hubs. It can work by itself. it only supports wifi 2.4ghz for connectivity

in regards to security i found this that may shed some light
https://www.iot-tests.org/2018/11/yeeli ... rity-test/
https://www.xiaomitoday.com/2019/02/02/ ... erability/
https://www.reddit.com/r/cybersecurity/ ... urely_use/
https://www.reddit.com/r/homeassistant/ ... _lan_mode/
https://www.reddit.com/r/PFSENSE/commen ... yeelights/

That said, both OH and HA work in QNAP either via containers (I hate to use containers, my qnap becomes unstable, but this option is free of charge), or paid qpkg's (OpenHab3 has a residual cost, and HA requires a paid Apache qpkg).

correct. in regards to getting home assistant to work with qnap, container station docker app seems to be the way to go. becauz the qpkg requires a purchase for apache server from qnapclub if not mistaken. with the container station install method, it's free (with limitations as mentioned by paul hilbert, though i only use the basic features so it doesn't seem like an issue for me)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q10nVFbP0ME



trying to figure out a secure solution here for my requirement. maybe the answer is to get a raspberrypi, setup home assistant on that, and put that on the same iot network. that way i can have the iot on a separate vlan, and still be able to control HA via android via guest wifi (best not keep qnap on iot vlan, due to importance of such a data storage device). that's all i can think of to fix this but raspberry pis are over priced by scalpers.... but this guy suggest to opt for the cheaper Raspberry Pi Pico
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eIaEjB5zrA


https://community.home-assistant.io/t/r ... nel/437455

https://www.reddit.com/r/homeassistant/ ... assistant/

https://all3dp.com/2/raspberry-pi-pico- ... -compared/

https://howchoo.com/pi/raspberry-pi-pic ... ry-pi-zero

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaZkQeVKe1E

[moody_blue]

Regarding the VLAN issue: I use OpenHAB, not Home Assistant, but I guess the principle is the same. All my IoT appliances (wifi and ethernet) are on a separate vlan. The firewall (openwrt in my case) blocks internet traffic in the iot lan (but I can open it occasionally for sw maintenance).

My NAS has 2x ethernet ports connected to a smart switch. These ports are defined (in QTS and in the switch) as balance-rr. The IoT is also defined (attached figure).

In terms of VLAN's the ports are defined in the switch as LAG2 and:
- vlan 2000 (home) untagged + pvid
- vlan 4000 (iot) tagged

I have checked that OpenHab detects both NAS networks (192.168.128.10/24 and 192.168.130.210/24). In the home network I have Unifi (plus some other appliances, such as TV's, that I also manage with OH), and in the IoT network I have the home automation appliances (ar conditioner, shelly, sonoff, zigbee gateways, ecowitt gateways, etc). It works very well.

Hope this helps.

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

ty it did. now i know more :}

The firewall (openwrt in my case) blocks internet traffic in the iot lan (but I can open it occasionally for sw maintenance).

ooo thats interesting.

but the part that confuses me though, i get that you are vlan to separate them out. but then for usability, how exactly are you communicating to the iot vlan using say an android smartphone to control the devices?

i'm assuming that you have a WIFI vlan setup to that IOT vlan (basically same vlan tag), so u switch to that wifi IOT vlan to be able to do so.

Do you keep ur mobile devices and iot on same network? because based on those security articles i mentioned, seems even ur mobile devices can be susceptible to attacks by iots. so u then have to keep the mobile devices away from iot networks as well.

but then this still comes back to, how then to interact with iot if they are on separate vlan e.g. when i want to on/off smart led using android smartphone.

i thought that avahi on pfsense would be a solution to this, but i doubt i ever got this to work. basically it's suppose to allow traffic in one direction but not the other. So your private lan can access your other vlan stuff, but your vlan can't do the same. But in their use case, they were using google chromecast as an example what it's for. i just assume it would also work for things like iot smart leds as well
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYKfmS5_3r0


but in terms of iot security, paul hilbert summed it up, either hubitat, or home assistant
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q10nVFbP0ME


hubitat uses a hub, but at least it keeps the iot OFF the cloud (i never liked these cloud features cauz i felt they were a security and privacy hazard ). then the home assistant (from my setup to basic usage, it felt easy to use. however, for further tweaking/tinkering, it does begin to become more complex when dabbling in scripts, though to be fair you can copy/paste scripts and follow guides carefully, but it's still a hassle to some that don't enjoy spending too much time and effort on this). he also mentioned in other youtube videos he did, about some other iots that are also similarly OFF the cloud (basically localized on the lan), but i can't point exactly which device he was referring, other than it was a led light is all i can recall.

the reason why i went for a yeelight led, was because it omits having to use a hub, and it had a lan feature for use with home assistant, so then you had an option to stay off the cloud. but whether that rely worked in practise, i only could find out/explore after purchasing it first (i did try doing my research first, but u don't always know everything and sometimes u have to try in person to gain practical understanding of it, so it was worth if only to learn so i don't make the same mistakes in future for iots)



the one thing i've learned most about iot is the fact some of these devices have a risk that if the company goes under or decides to stop updating their app, or shutdown their cloud server, there is high odds that your smart led could no longer function. I find this very unacceptable, and this is why i've been trying my hardest to stay away from iot devices that have this sort of risk hanging over your head. the other thing is the security aspect. less cloud to no cloud is better than having cloud (unless u rely need that feature, i don't. home lan wifi is more than sufficient for me)


anyway not familiar with openHAB, so i found this to find out more

Automate Your Home with openHAB
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uqusn5MmaM4

Home Assistant vs OpenHAB - Which one is better?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4jrE_MtRWc

[moody_blue]

but the part that confuses me though, i get that you are vlan to separate them out. but then for usability, how exactly are you communicating to the iot vlan using say an android smartphone to control the devices?

I can access IoT LAN from home lan (but not the reverse). Here are my firewall rules (probably I don't need the NAS parametrized to access vlan 4000, but I did not test).

OpenHab has an Androd / iPhone client so I don't feel the need to use miriads of supplier apps. In fact, I only use them to update firmware.

I will never embark in a discussion of which product is better, OH or HA

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

thx. i'll and slowly digest that and somehow translate it to what it should look like in pfsense. but at least i got a clue how this may work.

i also found this


this sounds exactly what i need (it can operate without cloud ). i only found this video so far about it. This is probably the led and platform i was referring to earlier.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVDnrQ9wIUM

also can do like what you suggested. only when u want to check for updates and to update from time to time then you toggle this cloud feature on temporarily then quickly turn it off once your done. and it's got a quick toggle to do this too

will do more research on this.

Shelly Vintage
-has an embedded webserver
-can function as a standalone device, as an accessory to a home automation controller, or it may be used as another automation system's component.
-has been designed for installation in a standard light socket – E27

https://shop.shelly.cloud/shelly-vintag ... aulhibbert



Shelly Duo - CW/WW Wifi LED bulb from Shelly
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvBdwW_0w-8




embeded webserver... sounds like no hub required? u just connect it to your wifi. Then access the webserver locally via wifi and in shelly android app set the cloud services to disabled (which probably means now it's all local lan), and it doesn't have the same risk other iots have if those companies go under and/or shutdown their cloud service thus killing your iot devices. o and another nice thing about the shelly it's developed and made in the EU unlike yeelight which is xiaomi aka China (tin hat foil engaged )

nice and simple



found this for yeelight for topics how to off cloud if possible

Question about Yeelights in HA - Still using cloud?

I've just added my first Yeelight bulbs to Home Assistant. Cheap, superb bulbs, and very easy to add to HA without any modifications. Love 'em!

As required, when setting them up through the Yeelight app, I set them to LAN mode and Home Assistant detected them (after adding a few lines to configuration.yaml). All good.

However, I'm wondering if these bulbs still talk to the cloud or not. I've taken moderate pains to ensure my set up is 100% within my own network; no cloud allowed.

I know the Yeelights would now work without internet connectivity, but I'm curious if anyone knows whether they're still communicating their own cloud system? If so, is there anything I could do about that, while retaining full Home Assistant functionality?

Warrenzwick-

You can add pihole on ha and then yeelight to the block list

dadoj
·
2 yr. ago

Simply block all communication on your router originating from each bulb where target address is outside of your network. Make sure their ip addresses assigned by your DHCP server are static for each of the bulbs.

And then you can be 100% sure.

https://www.reddit.com/r/homeassistant/ ... ing_cloud/

https://forum.yeelight.com/t/topic/18154

https://www.reddit.com/r/PFSENSE/commen ... all_rules/

Office Network Design and Planning with VLANs, LLDP, Rules, IoT, Guest using UniFi & pfsense
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ouARr-4chJ8

notes: lawrence explains how he lays out iot isolation using vlans in this video. very useful

i see that lawrence sets his vlan for guest and iot, to block private lan, but the guest and iot are allowed to talk to each other. he said it's optional if u want to prevent that, but he doesn't bother (this is my current setting atm since i followed his setup)

[moody_blue]

Shellys with its native operating system should work ok with HA (they do with OH) without need for their cloud app. The same for yeelights.

But in my case I've flashed almost all lamps / relays / switches with Tasmota and I use MQTT to control them. This is not only for consistency, it's also for security. Also, Tasmota has its own programming language and this is sometimes usefull. For example, in my case boiler is activated by OH if needed but switches off automatically by Tasmota. Another example, my garden system performs its daily irrigation cycle using tasmota, OH only defines each pump's operating time (according to sensors and weather forecast). This way I assure that critical functions do not depend on OH or wifi availability.

[Schelbert]

Hi, I have a question about this install.

I managed to install the latest Home Assistant OS as a VM running in QNAP Virtualization Station. Most of the time I'm not on the same network so I need to connect remotely, that's exactly what I'm struggling with. I can interact with the CLI (in console) but that's it. How can I remotely connect to these 2 links: http://homeassistant.local:8123
and http://homeassistant.local:4357. My_QNAP_IP:8123 doesn't work.
Also how do I configure the virtual switch for this VM? And how do I connect using VPN. I have no problems with connecting remotely to container station containers through VPN but this is difficult for me to find a working solution.

TIA!