QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

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gregreid
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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by gregreid » Fri Jun 19, 2020 7:52 pm

That's all very useful information, Dan/Gib, and I appreciate you taking the time to post it. I'm the only guy on the planet who doesn't own a USB keyboard, so I ordered a $10 one from Amazon yesterday so that I can hammer on DEL/F2 during boot. I also ordered a 2G USB thumb drive (as all of my USB thumb drives are much bigger). I'll let you know of my results when I have them. Thank you again!

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gibxxi
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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by gibxxi » Sat Jun 20, 2020 12:59 am

I already had a small form-factor (30cm wide) USB keyboard i'd previously used with my HTPC, with a Wireless dongle. So it was free to use on the NAS. A SD-Card used with a USB Card Reader / Adapter will also work, but I would go down the safe route and use a USB2.0 adapter for the reasons already mentioned, if you decide to try this. All that's required is a (bootable) USB storage device that appears to a host system as a "Hard Disk" USB device.

I hope your expenditure doesn't turn out to be a waste of money, but better to waste $10-20 and resurrect the existing NAS, than waste $300-400 on a new NAS and later realise you didn't need to. The (somewhat convoluted) instructions I posted above worked for me, and mine was stuck on the same "SYSTEM BOOTING" message on the LCD panel as everyone else.

When You power the NAS on, as long as you get the short single beep, the device has passed it's Power-On-Self-Test (POST) check, which *should* mean there's nothing wrong with the device at the hardware level. If the memory, graphics or CPU are damaged, the device won't POST at all (No Beep), and since the NAS LCD panel is reported to the system as a simple USB display device, the message "SYSTEM BOOTING" is probably displayed via some kind of start script, directed / targetted at that device. Also, on your monitor, while the screen displayed IS black by default, as long as the monitor DOESN'T go into standby shortly after power-on, or display the classic "No Signal Detected" message, you are actually getting HDMI output. On an older LCD panel, you can see backlight edge-bleed round the edge of the monitor, that's another clue that the monitor IS recieving a signal, just that the BIOS boot sequence information is being hidden from you by design. But it *should* still respond to <DEL> & <F2> keypresses (assuming the USB keyboard is detected properly, and your quick enough pressing either button).

Finally, assuming you have disabled "Quiet Boot" in the BIOS / CMOS, changed the device boot priority to the USB recovery key (F10 to save changes and reboot), and have successfully copied the recovery image to the correct folder on the DOM chip, via your USB key, power down the NAS, remove the USB recovery key (but keep the keyboard attached, just in case), then watch the boot process on the monitor. Once it completes, you'll still have no web access to QTS as there are no (RAID) Hard Disks installed at that point, and thus no QTS operating system. However, the device's ethernet will be active, and should be discoverable via QFinder. Login using the QNAP default username / password (admin / password) via QFinder and verify the firmware shown accurately reflects that of the recovery firmware's filename. Then you can flash the latest version of the QTS firmware (4.4.2 - 1320) manually via QFinder and reboot the device again. Verify that once it has rebooted, that the firmware shown IS 4.4.2 - 1320, then you can power down the NAS via QFinder (administer device remotely), and re-insert your RAID hard disks and start it up again. The version of QTS (on your hard disks) should be upgraded to 4.4.2 - 1320 on that subsequent boot, so don't be surprised if the boot process takes a bit longer than normal. QFinder can be monitored once this stage occurs, to track it's progress, until such time as the "Loading Services" phase completes and you get the final notification beep from the device, at which point you should be able to log in via your web browser at the NAS IP address with your old admin credentials (if memory serves).

Dan / Gib.
"Si vis pacem para bellum!"
NAS1: QNAP TS453-Pro (8GB, 4x4TB WD-Red), NAS2: QNAP TS453-Mini (8GB, 4x2TB WD-Red).

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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by ldl01031 » Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:06 am

Yet another me too [after a little ranting I actually have a question...please see the last sentence or two].

I did an update several days ago, but didn't notice it was stuck on system booting until last night. I powered it off (all drive lights were green), then back on--at which time all four drives went red--and that was it. I went through every step here I could find (USB recovery stick, keyboard, monitor, etc.). Never saw a thing on HDMI, nor any other sign of life. I let it sit unplugged overnight hoping for some 'capacitor' miracle. Nada.

I guess this is one way to get new business--brick everyone so they are forced to rebuy. Sorry for the cynicism, but ? Since I've had even worse luck with LinkStation (two of them bricked in less than two years), I decided to <sigh> rebuy. I use this for backups only so I went for the 431KX-2G.

Question: Will I be able to stick my drives into the new machine (in the correct order) and expect things to 'work?' I'm going to try hooking up one drive at a time to a computer to see if I can get data off (I have some large items that only lived on the NAS--I figured 'they are mirrored, I should be quite safe'). Should I expect that to work?

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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by gregreid » Sat Jun 20, 2020 3:36 am

gibxxi wrote:
Sat Jun 20, 2020 12:59 am
When You power the NAS on, as long as you get the short single beep, the device has passed it's Power-On-Self-Test (POST) check, ...
Oh!, stupid me! No, I don't get any beep at all, and didn't notice that absence until you brought it up.

With no beep and no HDMI output, it would seem that I have a more serious hardware issue, and I might as well cancel my USB keyboard and flash drive order while I still can.

I'd already tried a new power supply (no difference in symptoms, and still no beep).

I've tried removing the drives, removing the two 4GB RAM cards, and unplugging the DOM. No beep, no HDMI, just the SYSTEM BOOTING >>> forever.

This TS-453 Pro was working perfectly well for 4+ years. I was running out of space on it and so bought an upgrade TVS-672N two weeks ago with six new 10TB disks, and successfully copied over all of the data from my 453 to the new 672 without issue (it took about 14 hours). Then I shut down the 453 and the 672 cleanly and unplugged them both so that I could swap their physical locations. It was only when I went to reboot the 453 that it gave the endless SYSTEM BOOTING >>>, and it's been that way ever since.

I guess the 453 is miffed that I bought the new one. :-/

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gibxxi
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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by gibxxi » Sat Jun 20, 2020 8:03 am

ldl01031 wrote:
Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:06 am
Yet another me too [after a little ranting I actually have a question...please see the last sentence or two].

I did an update several days ago, but didn't notice it was stuck on system booting until last night. I powered it off (all drive lights were green), then back on--at which time all four drives went red--and that was it. I went through every step here I could find (USB recovery stick, keyboard, monitor, etc.). Never saw a thing on HDMI, nor any other sign of life. I let it sit unplugged overnight hoping for some 'capacitor' miracle. Nada.

I guess this is one way to get new business--brick everyone so they are forced to rebuy. Sorry for the cynicism, but ? Since I've had even worse luck with LinkStation (two of them bricked in less than two years), I decided to <sigh> rebuy. I use this for backups only so I went for the 431KX-2G.

Question: Will I be able to stick my drives into the new machine (in the correct order) and expect things to 'work?' I'm going to try hooking up one drive at a time to a computer to see if I can get data off (I have some large items that only lived on the NAS--I figured 'they are mirrored, I should be quite safe'). Should I expect that to work?
If the firmware offered for the new device is also the same file used for the device being replaced, it might be possible (same or similar architecture), but I personally wouldn't risk it, without a backup of the data AND confirmation from QNAP or someone else who has successfully managed to perform the migration, that it works. While the firmware QNAP puts out does cover multiple devices, that doesn't automatically mean that it's installed in exactly the same manner. You can't transfer a hard disk from one Windows machine to a new machine, and just expect it to work, because some aspects of the hardware might differ. A similar rationale could be applied here, to a degree. Essentially, YMMV.

Dan / Gib.
"Si vis pacem para bellum!"
NAS1: QNAP TS453-Pro (8GB, 4x4TB WD-Red), NAS2: QNAP TS453-Mini (8GB, 4x2TB WD-Red).

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gibxxi
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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by gibxxi » Sat Jun 20, 2020 8:06 am

gregreid wrote:
Sat Jun 20, 2020 3:36 am
gibxxi wrote:
Sat Jun 20, 2020 12:59 am
When You power the NAS on, as long as you get the short single beep, the device has passed it's Power-On-Self-Test (POST) check, ...
Oh!, stupid me! No, I don't get any beep at all, and didn't notice that absence until you brought it up.

With no beep and no HDMI output, it would seem that I have a more serious hardware issue, and I might as well cancel my USB keyboard and flash drive order while I still can.

I'd already tried a new power supply (no difference in symptoms, and still no beep).

I've tried removing the drives, removing the two 4GB RAM cards, and unplugging the DOM. No beep, no HDMI, just the SYSTEM BOOTING >>> forever.

This TS-453 Pro was working perfectly well for 4+ years. I was running out of space on it and so bought an upgrade TVS-672N two weeks ago with six new 10TB disks, and successfully copied over all of the data from my 453 to the new 672 without issue (it took about 14 hours). Then I shut down the 453 and the 672 cleanly and unplugged them both so that I could swap their physical locations. It was only when I went to reboot the 453 that it gave the endless SYSTEM BOOTING >>>, and it's been that way ever since.

I guess the 453 is miffed that I bought the new one. :-/
This is a stretch, admittedly, but what about the CMOS battery? I assume (like a regular PC), these things will have one on the motherboard. They only generally last for about 5-7 years, tops, before they no longer accept a charge. A dead one will reset the date, time & CMOS settings back to defaults. You've nothing to lose by attempting a swap at this stage.

Dan / Gib.
"Si vis pacem para bellum!"
NAS1: QNAP TS453-Pro (8GB, 4x4TB WD-Red), NAS2: QNAP TS453-Mini (8GB, 4x2TB WD-Red).

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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by gibxxi » Sat Jun 20, 2020 8:19 am

I found this (eTeknix Review) of the TS453-Pro. For those interested, the location of the DOM chip and the CMOS battery are clearly visible in the fifth image on the linked page (main motherboard PCB). The DOM chip appears to be secured with epoxy resin, to prevent it coming loose from the M/B USB header it's connected to. These components will be on the reverse side of the board from the memory slots you see when sliding off the top cover.

Dan / Gib.
"Si vis pacem para bellum!"
NAS1: QNAP TS453-Pro (8GB, 4x4TB WD-Red), NAS2: QNAP TS453-Mini (8GB, 4x2TB WD-Red).

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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by AzJazz » Sat Jun 20, 2020 9:27 am

gibxxi wrote:
Sat Jun 20, 2020 8:19 am
I found this (eTeknix Review) of the TS453-Pro. For those interested, the location of the DOM chip and the CMOS battery are clearly visible in the fifth image on the linked page (main motherboard PCB). The DOM chip appears to be secured with epoxy resin, to prevent it coming loose from the M/B USB header it's connected to. These components will be on the reverse side of the board from the memory slots you see when sliding off the top cover.

Dan / Gib.
Got it, thanks! I can see the daughter board, and I'll figure out how to remove it.
My OS: Win7x64
NAS model: QNAP TS453 Pro
Firmware Version/Build numbers: 4.3.6
Network Setup (ie Single Port or Port Trunking): Single Port
Drive Configuration: RAID5 (3 x 4.0TB WD40EFRX Red)

Wintermoose
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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by Wintermoose » Tue Jun 23, 2020 5:39 am

It seems my unit was completely dead - no beeps, no HDMI signal. I took it apart (which was... interesting experience, compared to PC cases. I think I needed to remove almost every screw to get to the motherboard), tried to play with the memory, CMOS battery and the DOM daughterboard. No change.

I'd like to believe I was just unlucky, rather than "hitting a wall of the TS-453 pro life expectancy", because 5 years of service (and, as a backup unit, it was quite light use) is quite horrible, and rather bad value for the money.

Which brings the question: what next. Right now I don't feel like throwing another 500£+ Qnap's way, but is there any alternative?

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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by david.matthewson » Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:10 pm

and another one... TS 453. Like other guys here I was getting 'fan fail' alerts by email but when I went to the site the QNAP seemed OK. I then (via the gui) shut it down, moved it to a bench, tried to power up - no good. 4 x red LEDS and 'System Booting' for ever.

3 second reset and 10 second reset have no effect - no bleeps either.

Left it powered off for a few days, pulled the drives, retried, no good.

It seems to be to be highly suspect that so many of us are getting the 'fan' message and then 'system booting' all within a few weeks of each other. And yes, the NAS was recently updated to the latest firmware..

I'll raise a support ticket but suspect the answer is the trash can! ''Beyond economic repair''

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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by SunLL404 » Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:04 pm

Add another. TS-653 Pro-8G
Used for a medium business backup, it was kept at a data center for the last 5 years. I recall doing an update in the last month or so.
Sounds like the same issues. Got the email on Saturday that the fans were failing. Device dropped off the network shortly after. Checking on it Monday and fans were running. Powered it down and now all red lights for the HDs and System Booting across the LCD. I get nothing out of the HDMI output, and no beeps when powered on. I swapped around the memory cards with no changes.

Those that pulled out the mainboard: is there a JTAG like pinout that maybe we could see a console output from? Near the power button I see a 2x4 pingout, but being so close to the USB 3.0 port, I'm guessing that is USB. Otherwise I see an empty Com1 connector in line with the fan headers and a Com2 that is connected to the front panel. Com 3/4 is sans pins further toward the back panel.

Yeah we are out of warranty, but this seems to be too many issues for a coincidence.

MB shows QW37 Rev:1.7
Exact p/n is 52100-002079-RS

If QNAP wants to chime in I'll gladly send over serial number so we can see if it's a consistent batch that is failing.

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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by NAS_Q_User » Sun Jul 12, 2020 9:00 pm

Same problem occured to me this morning.

Got an email telling me: [Hardware Status] System fan 1 failed.

TS-453Pro is stuck in Boot, Harddisk 4 LED is Red, am running a RAID 5 set-up.

Checked for dust a week ago so that cannot be the problem.

Update:
when trying to boot the NAS without any drives, the red light for Harddisk 4 is also on indicating that it seems to be a Hardware error.
Booting with no drives does not work either, I also get no beep indicating the System passed its Power-On self-test.
Last edited by NAS_Q_User on Mon Jul 13, 2020 12:34 am, edited 4 times in total.

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dolbyman
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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by dolbyman » Sun Jul 12, 2020 9:43 pm

qnap will not chime in, if you do not contact them ...they do not come here

Yippym
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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by Yippym » Tue Jul 14, 2020 8:14 pm

This topic is starting to sound like an Intel Atom C2000 bug, the CPU in the TS-453 Pro is the J1900 that is based on the Silvermont Architecture.

The Intel Atom E3800 series started to have issue of boot after long usage https://www.servethehome.com/another-at ... vli89-bug/

hallux
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Re: QNAP TS-453 Pro stuck on "SYSTEM BOOTING"

Post by hallux » Tue Jul 14, 2020 8:58 pm

Very similar indeed! Did anyone open a ticket with QNAP regarding this in order to know what is their response?
Yippym wrote:
Tue Jul 14, 2020 8:14 pm
This topic is starting to sound like an Intel Atom C2000 bug, the CPU in the TS-453 Pro is the J1900 that is based on the Silvermont Architecture.

The Intel Atom E3800 series started to have issue of boot after long usage https://www.servethehome.com/another-at ... vli89-bug/

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