Just 11 MB/s on TS-431P. Why so slow ?!?

[midiboy]

Hi everyone,
got myself a TS-431P together with 3x Seagate 8 TB Barracuda Pro ST8000DM005 harddiscs in Raid 5. I updated the firmware to the latest available one, created a 12 TB Volume (Thick Multiple Volume) on the 16 TB storage space and enabled encryption. Then I waited a day till the syncing between the discs stopped, mounted a share as a network drive in Windows 10 x64 and started Crystal DiscMark. The connection between NAS and PC is via a Linksys 8-port Gigabit-switch. I also tried without the switch and just using the 4port switch on my router with very similar results so it cannot be a network limit.

Now, Qnap touts 190 MB/s Read and 124 MB/s Write for AES 256 bit encryption on the product page for the TS-431P: https://www.qnap.com/en/product/model.php?II=259

I am not expecting the exact same high numbers but I am only getting around 11 Mb/s with a similar sample size of 8GB (the QNAP test used a 10 GB file). Here are the DiskMark results:

cdm.JPG

I then tried to just copy a 30 GB file from the PC to the Network drive in Windows and again, I am maxing out at 11 MB/s.
What is going on here? This cannot be normal?!?
Any ideas?

copy.JPG

[dolbyman]

sure the drives are compatible ? stxxxdm drives have a horrible track record in nas applications

anyways ...11 MB/s sounds like something along the way is not connecting with gigabit speed...you are hitting the fast ethernet speed limit

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

it says desktop drives.... uh.... did you check compatibility list
https://www.qnap.com/en/compatibility/? ... category=1


[youtube=]7KcjqUamRxw[/youtube]


*update

my reply maybe a bit too snobbish my bad, i'm not perfect. But i don't think running desktop hdd for raid5 is good idea just a fact especially at such big capacities... bit risky.

[AlastairStevenson]

I am not expecting the exact same high numbers but I am only getting around 11 Mb/s with a similar sample size of 8GB (the QNAP test used a 10 GB file)

I'd bet that IS a network limit - it's exactly what you'd get with a 100Mbps link speed.
Despite that you have a Gigabit switch, you may have a faulty cable or other problem causing a link speed downgrade negotiation.

Suggestion:
Check the switch - do the link detect lights show the negotiated speed?
SSH in to the NAS and check the network status.
Use ifconfig to see the active interfaces and error counts if any, and ethtool to see the hardware status.
eg on a TS-431+:
*edit* Apologies to dolbyman for the overlap response.

Code: Select all

[~] # ifconfig
eth0      Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 00:08:9B:E9:92:B2  
          inet addr:192.168.1.201  Bcast:192.168.1.255  Mask:255.255.255.0
          UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST  MTU:1500  Metric:1
          RX packets:73991 errors:0 dropped:5258 overruns:0 frame:0
          TX packets:43269 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
          collisions:0 txqueuelen:1000 
          RX bytes:6917063 (6.5 MiB)  TX bytes:3412569 (3.2 MiB)

eth1      Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 00:08:9B:E9:92:B3  
          UP BROADCAST MULTICAST  MTU:1500  Metric:1
          RX packets:0 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
          TX packets:0 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
          collisions:0 txqueuelen:1000 
          RX bytes:0 (0.0 B)  TX bytes:0 (0.0 B)

lo        Link encap:Local Loopback  
          inet addr:127.0.0.1  Mask:255.0.0.0
          UP LOOPBACK RUNNING  MTU:65536  Metric:1
          RX packets:11856 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
          TX packets:11856 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
          collisions:0 txqueuelen:0 
          RX bytes:1274193 (1.2 MiB)  TX bytes:1274193 (1.2 MiB)

[~] # ethtool eth0
Settings for eth0:
	Supported ports: [ TP MII ]
	Supported link modes:   10baseT/Half 10baseT/Full 
	                        100baseT/Half 100baseT/Full 
	                        1000baseT/Full 
	Supported pause frame use: No
	Supports auto-negotiation: Yes
	Advertised link modes:  10baseT/Half 10baseT/Full 
	                        100baseT/Half 100baseT/Full 
	                        1000baseT/Full 
	Advertised pause frame use: No
	Advertised auto-negotiation: Yes
	Speed: 1000Mb/s
	Duplex: Full
	Port: MII
	PHYAD: 4
	Transceiver: internal
	Auto-negotiation: on
	Supports Wake-on: pg
	Wake-on: g
	Current message level: 0x00000007 (7)
			       drv probe link
	Link detected: yes
[~] # 

[midiboy]

Hi guys,

thanks a lot for your quick answers

@dolbyman and @AlastairStevenson

You were right. For some reason my Desktop PC only allows for 100Mbit connection. I already updated the driver and switched the cable ... must be a hardware problem with the onboard network card (Realtek).

I have switched on my my notebook (only has 802.11ac WiFi) and there i am getting a bit better speed, but still nowhere close to the figures on the website:

Capture.JPG

I supposed that is the maximum for WiFi now, isn't it?
Still appears quite low, especially the 20 MB/s read value.

As for the discs:
@Moogle Stiltzkin

I got the Barracuda Pro, which apparently is suited for 24hr operation and has 5 years of warranty. It*s not a normal desktop drive, Seagate even says it is suited for DAS and Home server use:
http://www.seagate.com/www-content/prod ... 1701gb.pdf

I just got them so I could still exchange them but I dont really think my speed problems are due to the drives, that would be quite weird imo.

[dolbyman]

wifi speeds are effectively far under what they advertise ..so 20MB/s miggt be all you can get on wifi

no the speed problems are not from the drives..but if seagate mentions that the drives are for das storage ..then they admit they are not for nas storage

I would swap the drives for nas approved drives

[midiboy]

Ok, I found an old Intel Pro 1000 PT PCIe network adapter and with that installed on my PC I am finally getting closer to the speeds I expected.

cdm.JPG

While the Write value is almost where Qnap says it should be on the product page, the Read value is still only half (Qnap says 190 MB/s). However, I only have 1 network cable attached, I think Qnap used both adapters to somehow get more speed. Anyway, I am glad I am getting closer to the target speeds with your help!

Oh btw, I ordered 3 of the H3IKNAS800012872SWW HGST Deskstar NAS 8 TB drives and will return the Barracudas as you guys suggested. They Deskstar 8 TB NAS drives are not in the compatibility list but the 6 TB versions are so I hope I will be fine with those.

[dolbyman]

yeah .. you will only get over 110Mbit if you use several network connections and several clients .. so your values and basically maxing out the Ethernet speed

[AlastairStevenson]

Well, that's a good result all round, and a good example of how the community knowledgebase works.

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

no the speed problems are not from the drives..but if seagate mentions that the drives are for das storage ..then they admit they are not for nas storage

I would swap the drives for nas approved drives

but i thought that nas and das both pretty much mean raid certified hdds for using a bunch of hdds in close proximity together, 24/7 op, and able to perform raid sync.

or am i mistaken though this the first i've heard of das as a marketing term for hdds, when these days it's nas hdds. before that it was simply raid certified hdds.

As for the discs:
@Moogle Stiltzkin

I got the Barracuda Pro, which apparently is suited for 24hr operation and has 5 years of warranty. It*s not a normal desktop drive, Seagate even says it is suited for DAS and Home server use:
http://www.seagate.com/www-content/prod ... 1701gb.pdf

I just got them so I could still exchange them but I dont really think my speed problems are due to the drives, that would be quite weird imo.

i'll see what others are saying about this, sounds interesting because in their own chart they say suitable for desktop. not nas.




on a professional reviewer site they say

The Barracuda Pro is a compute drive meaning it is suitable for desktops, home servers, and even DAS with a solid 300TB/YR rating.

[youtube=]ZMQbPQA40ms[/youtube]

there i found this

Another point of failure is the drives themselves. Many users (myself included) have traditionally opted for cheap consumer drives for NAS units. After all, if they work fine in our desktop systems, what’s the problem with using them in a NAS, right? Wrong! If you’re running any RAID array using standard consumer drives such as a Seagate Barracuda, Western Digital Green, etc, your data is at risk.

I’ve had a number of readers ask me why their RAID arrays in their brand new NAS units keep degrading and almost every time, it’s because they’re using either WD Green hard drives, WD Blue hard drives, or Seagate Barracudas. If this happens to you, it’s not the NAS units that are at fault. Don’t return them or RMA them. It’s probably the drives.

Let me explain…

https://www.custompcreview.com/articles ... nas/19177/


The only time i used desktop drives was with the 2tb Samsung HD203WI which i still am using for my ts-659 Pro II. only 1 out of 5 had a problem but only after 5+ years of running 24/7 (which is the expected life of operation you'd expect anyway) :X Also it's in the compatibility list.

https://www.qnap.com/en/compatibility/? ... category=1

[P3R]

but i thought that nas and das both pretty much mean raid certified hdds for using a bunch of hdds in close proximity together, 24/7 op, and able to perform raid sync.

No DAS for home use, especially when the usage is specifically described as "Entry-level direct-attached storage devices (DAS)" as it is on the disk data sheet, means a single external disk directly connected (with USB, Thunderbolt, eSATA, FireWire or similar) to the computer rather than to the network.

Yes there are some DASes that use multiple disks in RAID but those are the odd exceptions.

NASes should have NAS or Enterprise disks, preferably listed on the compatibility list for the NAS model or at least similar models.

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

but i thought that nas and das both pretty much mean raid certified hdds for using a bunch of hdds in close proximity together, 24/7 op, and able to perform raid sync.

No DAS for home use, especially when the usage is specifically described as "Entry-level direct-attached storage devices (DAS)" as it is on the disk data sheet, means a single external disk directly connected (with USB, Thunderbolt, eSATA, FireWire or similar) to the computer rather than to the network.

Yes there are some DASes that use multiple disks in RAID but those are the odd exceptions.

NASes should have NAS or Enterprise disks, preferably listed on the compatibility list for the NAS model or at least similar models.

oo... i see. mind if i add that to my faq list?

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

As for the discs:
@Moogle Stiltzkin

I got the Barracuda Pro, which apparently is suited for 24hr operation and has 5 years of warranty. It*s not a normal desktop drive, Seagate even says it is suited for DAS and Home server use:
http://www.seagate.com/www-content/prod ... 1701gb.pdf

I just got them so I could still exchange them but I dont really think my speed problems are due to the drives, that would be quite weird imo.

just a small update

spandotcom -
It can be used, but the NAS HDD is not just about being on for extended periods of time. it is about sporadic read and write operations (a desktop is consistant and a NAS is intermittent), the vibration, heat and noise of drives that are in a RAID (common to NAS devices from Synology and QNAP)

yeah... i just don't think it's wise to use these drive for NAS, just friendly tip

[seagate_surfer]

We recommend sticking with NAS-rated drives like the IronWolf or IronWolf Pro over the BarraCuda Pro. For one, IronWolf drives are among those on the QNAP compatibility tool for this model (BarraCuda/BarraCuda Pro are not), and it's not just a matter of being rated fo 24x7 use.

IronWolf drives have RV sensors in sizes 4TB and over, and all IronWolf drives have firmware engineered towards NAS use. This has to do with vibration considerations, as large amounts of huge storage capacity drives can really beat up on and wear down on each-other with the sheer force of the vibrations in these enclosed spaces.

Another concern is that drives meant for NAS units have networking considerations in mind when they are engineered, as the nature of DAS vs NAS means that in DAS, drives are directly attached to the device from which data is going to be handled , and networking doesn't come into play until after that exchange has already occurred, and in NAS, there is a network involved between the drive and the end-user device. The most important aspect that IronWolf and IronWolf Pro is made to handle the multiple users hitting the NAS, and is very much more suitable for file sharing capabilities.

[Moogle Stiltzkin]

We recommend sticking with NAS-rated drives like the IronWolf or IronWolf Pro over the BarraCuda Pro. For one, IronWolf drives are among those on the QNAP compatibility tool for this model (BarraCuda/BarraCuda Pro are not), and it's not just a matter of being rated fo 24x7 use.

IronWolf drives have RV sensors in sizes 4TB and over, and all IronWolf drives have firmware engineered towards NAS use. This has to do with vibration considerations, as large amounts of huge storage capacity drives can really beat up on and wear down on each-other with the sheer force of the vibrations in these enclosed spaces.

Another concern is that drives meant for NAS units have networking considerations in mind when they are engineered, as the nature of DAS vs NAS means that in DAS, drives are directly attached to the device from which data is going to be handled , and networking doesn't come into play until after that exchange has already occurred, and in NAS, there is a network involved between the drive and the end-user device. The most important aspect that IronWolf and IronWolf Pro is made to handle the multiple users hitting the NAS, and is very much more suitable for file sharing capabilities.

thx for the update i'll to my faq link then for others, i'm sure other user bound to ask the same thing again. one of these days i'll try a seagate when i get my hands on one