TVS-872XT dead after normal shutdown...

[Bob Zelin]

I have not seen this yet but you guys are getting me a bit worried.
It does look like a motherboard or power supply issue. Has any of you confirmed the culprit?
By chance I noticed that my backup unit, a 473, uses exactly the same power supply so I have a backup if something like this happens and it is indeed a power supply issue...

Hi -
you are worried ? I have installed more TVS-872XT's than probably anyone here. I have only seen one dead TVS-872XT, and now I see a second one being reported.
Please keep me up to date as to how this is being handled by QNAP. I am a little freaked out by reading this. The TVS-872XT is a "relatively" new product - and I hope this is not an inherent
problem with this model. I installed 3 just last week !!!!!!!

Bob Zelin

[rafale]

This puzzling. The motherboard should be identical to the 472XT and the 672XT for which we have not seen much of failure reports? I am very hesitant to power off my unit now. The symptom described appears to be CPU or maybe DRAM related now that I am reading more into it...

[weathernerd]

At a low level, the QNAP is a PC running linux.

The beep you normally get when you cut it on is a BIOS beep, just like a PC. I'm not even getting that. I suspect that if there were memory/CPU issues, we'd still get beeps from the motherboard/BIOS, just like a PC.

With the red light on, and no beeps, support gave me an RMA for the unit. It likely is the motherboard, per support.

Glad I saved the box

[Tryphon]

Another victim here : exactly the same problem with a TVS-872XT i manage at work. After a normal shut down, the NAS is dead... only a small red light on the motherboard. Also, I own a TS-559, TS-569, TS-653 since many years without any major trouble. What's happening with the TVS-872XT? The motherboard needs to be replaced ... so after another 1-2 years, what will happen to it?

We need to know what is really dead on this board and how to avoid a repetition.

Thanks.

[ChrisWallett]

Is there any news on the cause of this fault?
My 2 month old TVS-872XT is now in the same state - absolutely dead.
Chris W.

[Atnlsm123456]

Just found this thread and am here to tell you same exact issue with mine. It is hardly 12 months only and paid a fortune for it. So unhappy. This is my third Qnap - the others have had no issue. Very disappointed

[P3R]

It is hardly 12 months only and paid a fortune for it. So unhappy.

I can understand that but a TVS-872XT is covered by a 2-year warranty so you should be able to have it fixed for you.

[rafale]

2 years seems to be even a bit short. If this is widespread, I think the warranty should be extended... Pretty concerning to see all these problems.

[Big09]

Add me to the list, mine died in the same manner wouldn't power back up. Luckily under warranty, whew. I want another Qnap Nas but worried about reliability. Plus how do I get my files off the drives, without another Qnap Nas.

[dolbyman]

you need to have external backups..have backups at all times..thats how you get the data "off"

[Big09]

I count 9 of us so far with the same issue, I had upgraded the ram over a year ago 64gb no issues. Mine died about Thanksgiving. I wasn't able to update the firmware that came out about then, was running the one prior to that. Also I remember folks who had upgraded their CPU's having issues after firmware updates recently I'm wondering has the firmware been running some kind of checks and ruining the system if it wasn't as expected.

[cjthunder81]

I noticed this morning that Portainer seemed to completely disappear from Container Station. Rather than troubleshooting up front it since all of my container were up and running, I decided to reboot the system first. During reboot, the screen kept flashing System Rebooting but did nothing. I powered it off and now it's completely dead. Power button does nothing but the motherboard does have a red light. I'm not sure if it's a PSU or Mobo issue but I'm pretty ** at this point considering I purchased this unit in February of 2019. I have a ticket opened currently and now waiting in a queue to speak with QNAP.

[krock72]

Just want to add another TVS-872XT to the list. Had a customer with a TS-221 and needed to get the data off the drives, shut the system down and removed the drives.

Information 2020-12-13 03:34:38 admin 127.0.0.1 Power NAS Power Status [Power] System shut down on Sun Dec 13 03:34:38 EST 2020.

When I went to power it back up, nothing. I have a red light on the motherboard, and when I plug in the power supply I get zero fan movement on the PSU. Generally when I plus in these QNAPs, I get a small movement in the psu fan at the point it gets power, which leads me to believe the PSU is dead.

and now a small rant ...
I do understand that a NAS is not necessarily a backup, but we all know when you reach the amount of data an 8 bay nas can handle, onsite backups become a problem, and Online backups like crashplan and backblaze don't necessarily solve the issue at hand (access speed). After several phone calls, it seemed like "hey pack the whole unit up and ship it across the country of a turn around time of 7 business days". With ground shipping from the east coast, that works out to about 25-27 days before your back up and running. Of all the QNAPS I've had, the failure has been the NAS itself and not the hard drives. I was quoted over 675$ to purchase the advanced replacement, which is laughable, as I could buy an 8 bay ts-873 for a few hundred more and have an extra backup unit at the end of the whole process. BTW, that $675 also came with ground shipping on the advanced replacement unit.

It really seems to me that qnap is putting tons of effort into making sure that your best option for getting to your data fast is buying another unit. When I troubleshoot, I always look for fastest and easiest item first, and swapping a PSU is a no brainer 1st step in my opinion, but even getting that done is going to take about a week. It was 4-5 days (with weekend) to even get the RMA status started for advanced replacement of a PSU. Just figuring out which PSU is confusing. On QNAPs accessory page for the 872Xt, they list 2 and the naming conventions (PWR-PSU-250W-DT02 [$130] and SP-6BAY-PSU [$159] are listed with zero explanation of which unit I would need. I assume its the SP-6BAY-PSU but who the hell knows, and finding somewhere you could get one delivered fast is difficult to impossible.

I've been looking through these forums for years, and I've noticed that there is a universal constant, which is that any time someone has any sort of problem, its a guaranteed there will be a post telling the person that the solution was to have another backup of the data onsite. I get that this is true, but QNAP should also be held accountable as well. Support calls go like this:
user: Hi, nothing happen when I press the power button QNAP: ok, pack up your unit and send it back to California, where we will take up to 7 business days before shipping it back via ups ground.

For comparison, a intel core i5 nuc (NUC8i5BEK) is currently about 300$ and comes with a 3 year warranty, and advanced replacement is 25$ with next day shipping. In January purchased a a 10th gen I7 Nuc with a bad thunderbolt port, and since they were out of stock, intel sent me a check for full purchase price + tax. QNAP thinks they may be getting some 872XT next week, but know one really knows. QNAP has a huge presence on Amazon, but in there store they sell zero PSUs, which based on the number of PSU failures its ridiculous. Even on there own store, figuring out which PSU you might need is too difficult. QNAP needs to prioritize getting customers up and running as fast as possible without profiting off their own product failures.


End of rant, and please don't respond telling me I should have had a backup of my data, my drives are fine and I have backblaze for the really important stuff, and I'm not saying you're wrong.
Kevin

[P3R]

I do understand that a NAS is not necessarily a backup, but we all know when you reach the amount of data an 8 bay nas can handle, onsite backups become a problem...

It's not necessarilly more complicated to backup an 8-bay than a smaller NAS. The 8-bay can hold more data and therefore you need a larger and possibly faster backup destination and/or infrastructure, which make it more expensive, but it's not more of a problem. The same apply for a 2-bay as it does for an 8-bay or 16-bay - If you can't afford or manage a proper external backup destination for the data that have any value to you, then you're trying to store more data than you can handle.

Just figuring out which PSU is confusing. On QNAPs accessory page for the 872Xt, they list 2 and the naming conventions (PWR-PSU-250W-DT02 [$130] and SP-6BAY-PSU [$159] are listed with zero explanation of which unit I would need.

I agree, I've thought about the same thing in their Accessories Store and it is very unprofessional. Not being clear about such things is unfortunately a bad habit among many companies in the industry. I've often been upset by server manufacturers (at least Fujitsu and HP) issuing drivers and patches without having proper information about when and under which conditions each fix should be applied when there are multiple of them with non-logical version numbers.

Just taking care of these things, would be a very easy and cheap thing to do for a manufacturer to raise themselves above the competition. It doesn't sell new units initially, but it would definitely boost repeat sales.

End of rant, and please don't respond telling me I should have had a backup of my data...

You should have had a backup of your data, since you value it enough to be bothered about not having access to it for a while. The way it work here is that even if you rant people that disagree with you may speak up, whether you want it or not.

While I agree that advance replacement would be a considerably better service and that Qnap probably will have to offer that in some way eventually to not be left behind, I don't find your lack of local backups a valid argument for that position. The current Qnap policy is one of several reasons for why experienced admins gave you the advice that you've deliberatly decided to not follow. Now you know why they gave you that advice.

[krock72]

To be clear, I agreed with the "NAS is not a backup" stance, and when I said 8 bays present more of a problem, I simply meant more money, and where does it end. And before you say it, I know I shouldn't play with the big boys if I can't afford it. (of course you can still say it if you want)

Also, my data is fine, its the QNAP that failed, again! I would like to start seeing some failure rate stats for these units, because I fear we may all be shocked. Maybe i'm wrong, but in a QNAP system I think the drives should be the weak point, and I have had more qnaps failures than drive failures since 2005. And not that it matters, but the only reason I shut my unit down was to help a client with another unit that had failed. For a 2000$ unit in warranty, I find the lack of any troubleshooting and parts replacement, and a 3-4 week rma process to be punitive. That has nothing to do with how I backed up my data or if I even backed up my data. I had to make 4/5 phone calls just to get someone to discuss simply sending me a psu, which is the most likely issue.

Now, I like qnap more than synology, but here is how you can get to your data when your synology fails, even with raid (full disclosure I have never tried this on my synology), posted on a synology help page, I see no equivalent page from QNAP.
https://www.synology.com/en-us/knowledg ... using_a_PC

P3R, I don't know you and of course you have the right to respond as you see fit. I was simply separating what I felt was useful for everyone to know, that we could add another 872XT that quit working suddenly to a growing list, from my personal opinions, which have no real value to the group. And I pre-agreed with the fact that I should have backups to save someone the trouble of telling me I should have backups. I simply feel like QNAP has made moves to make a bad situation more difficult/expensive to fix. What I'm missing was things I wanted to try to set up on my QNAP, not the data on the drives.

Tone is tough to perceive on a forum post, so this all is meant in the friendliest way possible in case it doesn't come across that way. Happy Holidays!