what's up with QNAP's obsession with 2.5G Ethernet ?
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what's up with QNAP's obsession with 2.5G Ethernet ?
Hi -
there are LOTS of new models coming out with 2.5G ethernet. A QNAP QXG-10G1T card is $89. Why are all these new 2.5G ethernet models (and switch) coming out ?
You guys (you know who you are) know more than I do ! What am I missing here ?
Bob Zelin
there are LOTS of new models coming out with 2.5G ethernet. A QNAP QXG-10G1T card is $89. Why are all these new 2.5G ethernet models (and switch) coming out ?
You guys (you know who you are) know more than I do ! What am I missing here ?
Bob Zelin
Bob Zelin / Rescue 1, Inc.
http://www.bobzelin.com
http://www.bobzelin.com
- jaysona
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Re: what's up with QNAP's obsession with 2.5G Ethernet ?
2.5GbE is where the industry is going right now.
1. A large installed base of Cat5/5e cabling, which can't support 10Gbe, but 1 & 2.5GbE is possible in most installations, and 5GbE is possible in some clean (not noisy) environments.
2. New 802.11 wireless specs will have theoretical speeds up to 3Gbps
3. For the past 8 months or so Intel has been putting out 2.5Gbe controllers and chipsets.
4. Many Motherboard OEMs have been including 2.5GbE controllers on their gaming/enthusiast higher-end mobos.
5. Many SOHO switch makers have brought relatively affordable 2.5Gbe switches to market.
So, QNAP is just taking advantage of another revenue stream and hoping to capitalize on the lemming effect as everyone jumps on the 2.5Gbe bandwagon.
1. A large installed base of Cat5/5e cabling, which can't support 10Gbe, but 1 & 2.5GbE is possible in most installations, and 5GbE is possible in some clean (not noisy) environments.
2. New 802.11 wireless specs will have theoretical speeds up to 3Gbps
3. For the past 8 months or so Intel has been putting out 2.5Gbe controllers and chipsets.
4. Many Motherboard OEMs have been including 2.5GbE controllers on their gaming/enthusiast higher-end mobos.
5. Many SOHO switch makers have brought relatively affordable 2.5Gbe switches to market.
So, QNAP is just taking advantage of another revenue stream and hoping to capitalize on the lemming effect as everyone jumps on the 2.5Gbe bandwagon.
RAID is not a Back-up!
H/W: QNAP TVS-872x (i7-8700. 64GB) (Plex server & encoding host) / TVS-EC1080 (32Gig ECC) - VM host & seedbox
H/W: Asustor AS6706T (32GB) / Asustor AS7010T (16GB) (media storage)
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TS-670 Pro x2 (i7-3770s 16GB) / TS-870 Pro (i7-3770 16GB) / TVS-871 (i7-4790s 16GB)
H/W: QNAP TVS-872x (i7-8700. 64GB) (Plex server & encoding host) / TVS-EC1080 (32Gig ECC) - VM host & seedbox
H/W: Asustor AS6706T (32GB) / Asustor AS7010T (16GB) (media storage)
H/W: TS-219 Pro / TS-509 Pro
O/S: Slackware 14.2 / MS Windows 7-64 (x5)
Router1: Asus RT-AX86U - Asuswrt-Merlin - 3004.388.6_2
Router2: Asus RT-AC66U - Asuswrt-Merlin - 386.12_6
Router3: Linksys WRT1900AC - DD-WRT v3.0-r46816 std
Router4: Asus RT-AC66U - FreshTomato v2021.10.15
Misc: Popcorn Hour A-110/WN-100, Pinnacle Show Center 250HD, Roku SoundBridge Radio (all retired)
Ditched QNAP units: TS-269 Pro / TS-253 Pro (8GB) / TS-509 Pro / TS-569 Pro / TS-853 Pro (8GB)
TS-670 Pro x2 (i7-3770s 16GB) / TS-870 Pro (i7-3770 16GB) / TVS-871 (i7-4790s 16GB)
- dolbyman
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Re: what's up with QNAP's obsession with 2.5G Ethernet ?
2.5GbE chips and components are probably cheaper and as mentioned 2.5 GbE has better compatiblilty with existing user cables
maybe easier to cool ...
and most consumer nas are more in the range of 2.5GbE anyways ..so less complaints why the 4 spinning disk units cannot even get close to 1000MB\s (maybe)
that said
qnap started 2 years ago the mainstream units with the 'X' variants (10GbE and SFP+) ..then had the elusive 'N' variants with 5GbE ...and now releases lots of 2.5GbE stuff ..so effectively going backwards
maybe easier to cool ...
and most consumer nas are more in the range of 2.5GbE anyways ..so less complaints why the 4 spinning disk units cannot even get close to 1000MB\s (maybe)
that said
qnap started 2 years ago the mainstream units with the 'X' variants (10GbE and SFP+) ..then had the elusive 'N' variants with 5GbE ...and now releases lots of 2.5GbE stuff ..so effectively going backwards
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Re: what's up with QNAP's obsession with 2.5G Ethernet ?
.... so effectively going backwards. Yup. 10G has been out for years. Cat 6 cabling costs nothing. The Aquantia (now Marvell) 10G chips are dirt cheap. Why go thru all this effort ?
What do I know (oh - I know the answer to that question - absolutely nothing !).
Bob
What do I know (oh - I know the answer to that question - absolutely nothing !).
Bob
Bob Zelin / Rescue 1, Inc.
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- jaysona
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Re: what's up with QNAP's obsession with 2.5G Ethernet ?
Lolz!! Please, introduce me to every CFO you know of that will agree that Cat6 cabling "costs noting" and is will to spring for the cost of nothing to replace the installed Cat5/5e cable plant with Cat6 cabling. :pBob Zelin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 9:02 pm .... so effectively going backwards. Yup. 10G has been out for years. Cat 6 cabling costs nothing. The Aquantia (now Marvell) 10G chips are dirt cheap. Why go thru all this effort ?
What do I know (oh - I know the answer to that question - absolutely nothing !).
Bob
There is no going backwards, here, this is purely a play by QNAP at capitalizing on what is currently out there and not leaving money on the table. Good for them.
RAID is not a Back-up!
H/W: QNAP TVS-872x (i7-8700. 64GB) (Plex server & encoding host) / TVS-EC1080 (32Gig ECC) - VM host & seedbox
H/W: Asustor AS6706T (32GB) / Asustor AS7010T (16GB) (media storage)
H/W: TS-219 Pro / TS-509 Pro
O/S: Slackware 14.2 / MS Windows 7-64 (x5)
Router1: Asus RT-AX86U - Asuswrt-Merlin - 3004.388.6_2
Router2: Asus RT-AC66U - Asuswrt-Merlin - 386.12_6
Router3: Linksys WRT1900AC - DD-WRT v3.0-r46816 std
Router4: Asus RT-AC66U - FreshTomato v2021.10.15
Misc: Popcorn Hour A-110/WN-100, Pinnacle Show Center 250HD, Roku SoundBridge Radio (all retired)
Ditched QNAP units: TS-269 Pro / TS-253 Pro (8GB) / TS-509 Pro / TS-569 Pro / TS-853 Pro (8GB)
TS-670 Pro x2 (i7-3770s 16GB) / TS-870 Pro (i7-3770 16GB) / TVS-871 (i7-4790s 16GB)
H/W: QNAP TVS-872x (i7-8700. 64GB) (Plex server & encoding host) / TVS-EC1080 (32Gig ECC) - VM host & seedbox
H/W: Asustor AS6706T (32GB) / Asustor AS7010T (16GB) (media storage)
H/W: TS-219 Pro / TS-509 Pro
O/S: Slackware 14.2 / MS Windows 7-64 (x5)
Router1: Asus RT-AX86U - Asuswrt-Merlin - 3004.388.6_2
Router2: Asus RT-AC66U - Asuswrt-Merlin - 386.12_6
Router3: Linksys WRT1900AC - DD-WRT v3.0-r46816 std
Router4: Asus RT-AC66U - FreshTomato v2021.10.15
Misc: Popcorn Hour A-110/WN-100, Pinnacle Show Center 250HD, Roku SoundBridge Radio (all retired)
Ditched QNAP units: TS-269 Pro / TS-253 Pro (8GB) / TS-509 Pro / TS-569 Pro / TS-853 Pro (8GB)
TS-670 Pro x2 (i7-3770s 16GB) / TS-870 Pro (i7-3770 16GB) / TVS-871 (i7-4790s 16GB)
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Re: what's up with QNAP's obsession with 2.5G Ethernet ?
Not more and not less: 2.5G is the coming-up standard for more and more consumer devices (routers, NAS, mainboards, ...).
- dolbyman
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Re: what's up with QNAP's obsession with 2.5G Ethernet ?
long time no see Herr Schumaku..welcome back
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Re: what's up with QNAP's obsession with 2.5G Ethernet ?
Yes. It is wonderful to see Schumaku back on this forum ! OK, so now that you are here, and you are Mr. Netgear - I have a question for you Kurt. Netgear makes the M4300-96X switch which is
relatively reasonably prices for someone that wants an "easy to use" 40G switch (like those who want 40G cards in the QNAP, and on the workstations). But QNAP for 10 seconds started to push
25G, which is a much more realistic bandwidth to work with, with current storage technology. QNAP makes the QXG-25G2SF-CX4 which retails for only $247. But it appears that to get a 25G switch
from Netgear (the M4500 series) is about $15,000 !!!!!! A lot more than an M4300-96X 40G switch. Why ? I saw that Ubiquiti was going to release a 25G switch for cheap, but let's face it - that's not
their market. However, it IS Netgear's market. If 25G is available, and it's cheap - how come Netgear doesn't release a reasonable price 25G switch.
Hey - I could ask the same question about QNAP, with the 10G switches. They could compete with the Netgear XS series switches - but they don't. I don't know why. And now all of this 2.5G.
Bob Zelin
relatively reasonably prices for someone that wants an "easy to use" 40G switch (like those who want 40G cards in the QNAP, and on the workstations). But QNAP for 10 seconds started to push
25G, which is a much more realistic bandwidth to work with, with current storage technology. QNAP makes the QXG-25G2SF-CX4 which retails for only $247. But it appears that to get a 25G switch
from Netgear (the M4500 series) is about $15,000 !!!!!! A lot more than an M4300-96X 40G switch. Why ? I saw that Ubiquiti was going to release a 25G switch for cheap, but let's face it - that's not
their market. However, it IS Netgear's market. If 25G is available, and it's cheap - how come Netgear doesn't release a reasonable price 25G switch.
Hey - I could ask the same question about QNAP, with the 10G switches. They could compete with the Netgear XS series switches - but they don't. I don't know why. And now all of this 2.5G.
Bob Zelin
Bob Zelin / Rescue 1, Inc.
http://www.bobzelin.com
http://www.bobzelin.com
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Re: what's up with QNAP's obsession with 2.5G Ethernet ?
Hello
I suppose that for most 4 or 6 bays NAS, having a 10 Gbits is useless because RAID throughput of the mechanical disks it is far below 10 Gbits bandwidth.
So a 2.5 Gbits interface seems legit.
As an example I own a 453B and just upgraded it with a 10 Gbits card (the one with the 2 SSDs) and connected it to a Mikrotik 10Gbits switch (CRS326-24G-2S+IN) on a RJ45 10Gbit SFP+.
At best I am able to reach a 8.5 Gbit max speed when writing to the NAS without any network optimization (no Flow control, no Jumbo Frames, etc...) and using a short (30cm) CAT7 cable.
(when SSDs are used as cache).
If my 453B was fitted with an internal 2.5 Gbits NIC, it would have been enough for my needs.
But he geek inside my brain wanted more
Florent
I suppose that for most 4 or 6 bays NAS, having a 10 Gbits is useless because RAID throughput of the mechanical disks it is far below 10 Gbits bandwidth.
So a 2.5 Gbits interface seems legit.
As an example I own a 453B and just upgraded it with a 10 Gbits card (the one with the 2 SSDs) and connected it to a Mikrotik 10Gbits switch (CRS326-24G-2S+IN) on a RJ45 10Gbit SFP+.
At best I am able to reach a 8.5 Gbit max speed when writing to the NAS without any network optimization (no Flow control, no Jumbo Frames, etc...) and using a short (30cm) CAT7 cable.
(when SSDs are used as cache).
If my 453B was fitted with an internal 2.5 Gbits NIC, it would have been enough for my needs.
But he geek inside my brain wanted more
Florent
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Re: what's up with QNAP's obsession with 2.5G Ethernet ?
new 2.5gbe addon for either qnap nas or pc. price unknown. but this one unlike the qm2 addons does not have m.2 ssd slots, so i assume it should be cheaper than the qm2.
https://www.qnap.com/en/news/2020/qnap- ... nas-and-pc
for people that don't have the newer desktop motherboards or nas that have 2.5gbe, there is this addon.
*update
Price: US$67.00
Model:QXG-2G1T-I225
out of stuck?
https://shop.qnap.com/index.php?route=p ... uct_id=387
https://www.qnap.com/en/news/2020/qnap- ... nas-and-pc
for people that don't have the newer desktop motherboards or nas that have 2.5gbe, there is this addon.
*update
Price: US$67.00
Model:QXG-2G1T-I225
out of stuck?
https://shop.qnap.com/index.php?route=p ... uct_id=387
Last edited by Moogle Stiltzkin on Fri Aug 14, 2020 6:23 am, edited 3 times in total.
NAS
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[Backup] QNAP TS-653A (Truenas Core) w. 4x 2TB Samsung F3 (HD203WI) RaidZ1 ZFS + 8gb ddr3 Crucial
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[^] QNAP TS-509 Pro w. 4x 1TB WD RE3 (WD1002FBYS) EXT4 Raid5
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[Main Server] QNAP TS-877 (QTS) w. 4tb [ 3x HGST Deskstar NAS & 1x WD RED NAS ] EXT4 Raid5 & 2 x m.2 SATA Samsung 850 Evo raid1 +16gb ddr4 Crucial+ QWA-AC2600 wireless+QXP PCIE
[Backup] QNAP TS-653A (Truenas Core) w. 4x 2TB Samsung F3 (HD203WI) RaidZ1 ZFS + 8gb ddr3 Crucial
[^] QNAP TL-D400S 2x 4TB WD Red Nas (WD40EFRX) 2x 4TB Seagate Ironwolf, Raid5
[^] QNAP TS-509 Pro w. 4x 1TB WD RE3 (WD1002FBYS) EXT4 Raid5
[^] QNAP TS-253D (Truenas Scale)
[Mobile NAS] TBS-453DX w. 2x Crucial MX500 500gb EXT4 raid1
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Resources
[Review] Moogle's QNAP experience
[Review] Moogle's TS-877 review
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- dolbyman
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Re: what's up with QNAP's obsession with 2.5G Ethernet ?
I got a QXG-10G1T for around 100 Dollars, not sure what kind of savings they need to offer to make a 2.5GbE card a bestseller (25 bucks ?)